Daniel 11’s End-Time Prophetic Sequence
By Bob Thiel                                                                          November 11, 2007

 

Executive Summary

 

 

Contents

I.                 Introduction                                                                                                                2

II.               Why the Question: When Does the King of the North Attack the King of the South?       3

III.             LCG Teaches Future Fulfillments in Daniel 11                                                        6

IV.            Key Scriptures in Daniel 11 and Matthew 24                                                            6

V.              Daniel 11:27-39 Beginning with a Daniel 11:27-45 Summary                                 8

VI.            Portions of Habakkuk May Be Prior to Vs. 39                                                              19

VII.          Portions of Hosea Might Be Between Vs.39 & 40                                                        20

VIII.        Daniel 11:40-45                                                                                                              22

IX.            Time of Jacob's Trouble and Daniel 12                                                                         24

X.              Daniel 8                                                                                                                          27

XI.            Assyria: Psalm 83 and Isaiah 10                                                                                    27

XII.          The Other Order                                                                                                             32

XIII.        Minor Rewrite 1. R.C. Meredith’s Fourteen Signs Announcing Christ's Return          34

XIV.       Minor Rewrite 2. J. Ogwyn’s The Beast of Revelation Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality? Booklet                                                                                               35

XV.         Minor Rewrite 3. R. Ames’ Middle East In Prophecy booklet                                                 37

XVI.       Summary of Key Points                                                                                                 37

 

Appendix:

  1. John Wheeler and Translations of Daniel 11:39                                                                 39

B.  LCG and the 1335, 1290, and 1260 Days                                                                             41                                

 

I. Introduction

 

Unlike many papers that are sent for your consideration by various ones, this particular paper was not my idea.  It came about because another couple in the Arroyo Grande, California videogroup  noticed that there was a contradiction in the official Living Church of God (LCG) literature.  I mainly got involved to get HQ to correct the contradiction in the literature.

 

To do so, as most of you realize, I documented this and sent it in a several years ago.  In addition to various ones still with LCG, at that time I also spoke to John Ogwyn, Carl McNair, Charles Bryce, and through his brother Carl, Raymond McNair about this.

 

Since my last submittal, the contradiction between some statements written by RC Meredith and John Ogwyn were slightly minimized, but my discussions with all of our HQ evangelists have convinced me that we as a church are unsure of the proper prophetic sequence.  And even now, there is a sequence in the current TW magazine (TWM) in an order that I believe is incorrect and contradicts the account in John Ogwyn’s The Beast of Revelation Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality?

 

Furthermore, in our Official Statement of Fundamental Beliefs we state that the “great tribulation” begins in Daniel 11:40, but our writings support vss. 35 or 39 (which I believe is correct) or verses 41-42 (which I feel are a bit late).  I propose Daniel 11:39-45 as it contradicts nothing (even if you do not agree with the order this paper is proposing).

 

These are not simply technical points.  We are the ones who are to have a love of the truth (cf. 2 Thessalonians 2:10).  We are the ones who are accurately supposed to warn the world what is to happen (Matthew 24:14).  Additionally, when it is time to actually flee (Revelation 12:14), many of our people are going to be confused as we have sent out several mixed messages—this should not be. As we are near the end, we are the ones that are then supposed to be wise and the ones who should understand these prophecies (Daniel 12:10; Amos 3:7-8).

 

Maybe this is the time to clarify that understanding?

 

This is not simply an academic matter as there are basically four prophetic parts of the Bible that the Bible itself says we must soon understand if we, the Living Church of God (LCG), are who we have to be.  And although I have received some comments in the past that prior versions of this paper were a bit long, I would like to remind everyone what we are teaching outsiders and our own people about the complexity of prophecy:

 

Of course, the correct way to understand the Bible is to honestly and thoroughly put together all the scriptures dealing with any subject—including prophecy—and then through careful study and heartfelt prayer come to understand the whole picture.
     For instance, when you carefully compare the prophecies of Daniel, Revelation and Jesus’ Olivet Prophecy as recorded in Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21, a clear picture emerges… (Meredith, RC.  Will Jesus Christ Return Tonight?  Tomorrow’s World Magazine, November-December 2007, p. 5).

 

God wants us to be knowledgeable about what lies ahead…We need be knowledgeable of the sequence of events (Ames R.  Welcome the King.  Feast of Trumpet’s DVD for  9/13/07).

 

Hence, this paper, which attempts to tie in many prophecies is somewhat complex.  However, only  if we can tie in other related prophecies can we be reasonably certain that our prophetic understanding of these major matters is correct.   

 

In book sequence, the third of the four parts we must understand in the Bible comes from Matthew 24:15/Mark 13:14 which says to understand the abomination of desolation spoken by Daniel.  The fourth is implied in various portions of the Book of Revelation (e.g. 1:3), which simply states that one is blessed who understands.

 

But the first comes from Jeremiah:

 

The anger of the LORD will not turn back

Until He has executed and performed the thoughts of His heart.

In the latter days you will understand it perfectly

 

"The prophet who has a dream, let him tell a dream;

And he who has My word, let him speak My word faithfully (Jeremiah 23:20,28).

 

Since we teach that these are the latter days, we not need to understand this matter better, and of course in a manner faithful to God’s word.

 

The second comes from Book of Daniel, and that will be the main focus of this article:

 

And he said, "Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand (Daniel 12:9-10).

 

The “words” spoken of have to do with Daniel 11 & 12.  And while we in LCG seem to have nearly all the pieces, we do not seem to realize and clearly teach that we do have those pieces.  And once we do understand them more fully, this would seem to suggest the end will be much closer.

 

This paper will attempt to provide insight into the latter half of the 11th chapter of Daniel, clarify the order of certain attacks by the king of the North, and describe who is subject to the persecution in Daniel 11.   I am sorry that this paper is so long, but perhaps this is why only “the wise shall understand”—the subject is complex.

 

While this article will contain scriptures, along with my interpretation and understanding, it is not expected that even if my main points are correct, that this subject will not need more prayer, study, and editing.

 

II. Why the Question: When Does the King of the North Attack the King of the South?

 

The reason for this question is that we in LCG do not seem to clearly understand the answer.

 

Does the king of the North attack Joseph (U.S., Britain, Canada, Australia, New Zealand) and begin “the time of Jacob’s trouble” before he attacks the king of the South?

 

Or, does the “time of Jacob’s trouble” (Jeremiah 30:7) happen when the king of the North attacks the king of the South (Daniel 11:40)?

 

A Tomorrow’s World telecast (#276) that our videogroup watched last month basically stated that “the time of Jacob’s trouble” begins at Daniel 11:40.  Hence that is one recent and public view.  But one that seems to be in error.  And when I spoke with Dr. Meredith on this matter on November 9, 2007, he stated that he had not specifically intended to teach it the way the telecast was broadcasted.

 

The idea that Joseph was attacked prior to the king of the North attacking the king of the South appeared to be the end-time prophetic sequence that WCG sometimes taught from the late 1960s onwards.  And that is what the late John Ogwyn specifically told me he was taught at Ambassador College when I first asked him about this nearly 4 years ago.  Dr. Germano also told me the same thing in January 2007.  But this is not what Richard Ames recalls, nor what RC Meredith was originally taught—hence the fact of two differing teachings has led to confusion. 

 

Even the old WCG admitted that it did not fully understand Daniel 11 in late 1979, though it suggested that it could be figured out.  Notice the following:

 

The Bible does not give an exact sequence of coming events.  We must watch world events to discover when the prophecies will happen (Luke 21:36).  But in piecing together prophecies scattered throughout the Old and New Testaments, a general picture becomes clear (Stump K. The Arab World in Prophecy.  The Plain Truth. December 1979).

 

After the above was written, and just about the time it was published, Herbert Armstrong apparently decided that he did know more about the prophetic sequence associated with Daniel 11.  And he basically agreed with what Keith Stump wrote in probably the rest of that article (even though it was published with that tentative disclaimer).

 

What seems to have happened is that HWA originally (in the 1930s) felt that since Mussolini invaded Ethiopia and the UK and Britain were not destroyed, that the King of the North would attack the King of the South before the start of the Great Tribulation.  And this is what people like Dibar Apartian, RC Meredith, and Richard Ames were taught.

 

However, HWA changed his mind and the order (probably in the 1960s, which led to a small change in his Middle East in Prophecy booklet, though he did not grasp some of the related details until November 1979).  This change is also the sequence that we teach in our LCG booklet by J. Ogwyn titled The Beast of Revelation Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality?

 

Though there were earlier signs of change, the clearest written explanation from HWA on a change is probably what he wrote in 1979 in the old Pastor General's Report:  

 

The indication is the armies of the "beast" of Revelation 17, entering Jerusalem (Dan 11:41, Zech. 14:2), will stop this daily sacrifice "...And the abomination that maketh desolate set up." What is this abomination?

    This refers to Daniel 11:31 and Matthew 24:15...It is the armies--not a statue--that make Jerusalem desolate.

   From this time (Daniel 12:11) to Christ's coming will be 1290 days.

   Now, verse 12, "Blessed is he that waiteth, and comes to the 1335 days."

   Never before have we understood these periods of 1260, 1290. and 1335 days.  But it seems evident, now, a blessing is pronounced on us--GOD"S CHURCH--who wait and endure until the 1335 days--approximately 1335 days prior to Christ's coming. But since no one can know the day or hour of His coming, we probably shall not be able to know the exact day this 1335 days begins.  But apparently that is the time when OUR WORK SHALL END.  That will be a time when the UNITED Europe shall appear--the revival of the medieval "Holy Roman Empire."  We shall then be warned, and readied to be taken to a place of refuge and safety from the Great Tribulation.  Forty-five days later "the beasts armies" will surround Jerusalem.  Thirty days later the Great Tribulation will probably start with a nuclear attack on London and Britain--and possibly the same day or immediately after, on the United States and Canadian cities. 

   The GREAT TRIBULATION, we shall fully then realize, is the time of "Jacob's Trouble," spoken of in Jeremiah 30:7.  And Jacob's name was named on Joseph's sons, Ephraim and Manasseh (Gen. 48:16). At that time a third of the people in our nations will die, or shall have died, by famine and disease epidemics; another third will dies of the war--our cities being destroyed (Ezek. 6:6), and the remaining third will be carried to the land of our enemies as slaves (Ezek. 5:12).

Armstrong HW. The Time We Are In, Now. Pastor General's Report-Vol 1, No. 15, November 20, 1979, Page 2).

 

There are a few points above that may need a little work.  While I tend to believe that the persecution will probably begin at/near the 1335 days, I am less certain which day we stop proclaiming the gospel—though this may precisely be when it is stopped in an organized matter by LCG as opposed to by scattered and fleeing individuals (see my comments on Daniel 11:30 b).  Plus I believe that the King of the North will probably form a little earlier (though not be necessarily a major international figure until Daniel 11:27), and that the abomination may not simply be the armies, but perhaps some symbol of the religion of the king of the North (which is also what LCG’s current literature specifically indicates).  While the above account seems to indicate that HWA is jumping from Daniel 11:41 to 11:31—I contend that he did not intend to actually teach that going into the Middle East in verse 41 stops the sacrifice (which is not mentioned in vs. 41—it is mentioned in verse 31) and leads to the abomination in vs. 31 (which is also not mentioned in verse 41)—it simply does not follow.  I believe someone made a typographical error based upon some earlier HWA writing.

 

However, the reality is that HWA is teaching that at the beginning of the 1335 days the Beast power will exist and 45 days later he will surround Jerusalem--which is Daniel 11:31 in this case--and 30 days later the Great Tribulation begins with an attack against England and/or the USA and Canada.  Richard Ames, in his DVD sermon for the 2007 Feast of Trumpets titled Welcome the King, essentially seems to agree as he specifically stated that the abomination is set up at the 1290 days, and that the Great Tribulation begins 30 days later (see also Appendix B).

 

Presuming that HWA and Richard Ames are correct on the 1335/1290/1260 days (and I believe that they basically are), it would seem to be a contradiction to believe that the King of the North can invade the King of the South before the tribulation begins and that the time of Jacob’s trouble begins in Daniel 11:40, as opposed, for example, to Daniel 11:39. 

 

The bulk of this paper will provide scriptural and other information that seems to support the view that the king of the North does not overwhelm the king of the South until AFTER the king of the North invades the USA and many of its English-speaking allies.  I believe that the scriptural evidence overwhelmingly supports that conclusion.  I also believe that all of our literature (including electronic literature on the internet) should be modified to reflect this.

 

Furthermore, as I do understand the extremely busy schedules the HQ evangelists have, I am willing to submit minor related modifications to all the literature I can locate to better reflect this if this will help if you wish.

 

III. LCG Teaches Future Fulfillments in Daniel 11

 

Historically, consistent with our view on the duality of many prophecies, we in LCG have long believed that there were to be future fulfillments of Daniel 11.

 

Herbert Armstrong taught, that even though there were historical fulfillments (ante-types), that there would be future fulfillments of many verses beginning with vs. 31 and perhaps earlier (see PASTOR GENERAL'S REPORT - VOL.1, NO.15 NOVEMBER 20, 1979 The Time We Are In, Now by Herbert W. Armstrong, p.2).

 

LCG has taken the same position.

 

For example, in the Fourteen Signs booklet, Mr. Meredith wrote:

 

"And they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation" (Daniel 11:31). As we will discuss later, there will, at the end of this age, either be a temple or a special altar in Jerusalem…

 

Notice the time setting of this prophecy: "And some of those of understanding shall fall, to refine them, purge them, and make them white, until the time of the end; because it is still for the appointed time" (Daniel 11:35). The context of this prophecy is the end-time. Also, it is important to point out that the nature of many prophecies is dual. That is to say, there was one preliminary fulfillment of a prophecy in antiquity, and there is to be a yet future fulfillment of that scripture.


We learn in this chapter in Daniel that a powerful leader is yet to come on the world scene.

 

Thus, we in LCG clearly teach that is a future fulfillment in Daniel 11, at least from verse 31.  And by implication related to the 1335 days (see Appendix B), verse 30, and possibly before.

 

But before going further, I would like to point out that elsewhere in the Fourteen Signs booklet and the current TWM, Dr. Meredith sequentially goes from Daniel 11:40-43 to 11:31, and then to 12:1. That MAY a problem.

 

It appears more likely that Daniel 11:27-45 is in essentially the proper order sequentially. And, it is somewhat clear that at least the first part of Daniel 12:1 seems to fit within the 11:27-45 scenario—most likely vs. 35 (this is discussed in section IX).

 

IV. Key Scriptures in Daniel 11 and Matthew 24

 

The expressions 'the king of the South' and 'king of the North' only occur in Daniel 11 (10 and 8 times respectively). 

 

HWA, and even the worlds' churches, have correctly tended to believe that Daniel 11:2-39 has had fulfillments or at least ante-types through a variety of historical events, such as the splitting of Alexander the Great's kingdom into four pieces.

 

Furthermore, Antiochus Epiphanies did abolish the daily sacrifices and set up an abomination of desolation (vs. 31) and the Maccabees did exploits (vs. 32).  But since this was not the appointed time of the end, it would seem that none of the “fulfillments” prior to verse 27 could be the actual final fulfillment.

 

Notice that Jesus' taught,

 

Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand) then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains...And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect's sake those days will be shortened (Matthew 24:15-16,20-22, NKJV throughout unless otherwise noted).

 

This teaching is clear that there is a future fulfillment concerning the abomination of desolation. (The Greek word translated as 'abomination' in Matthew is the same Greek word translated as abomination in Revelation 17:4&5—which speaks of the “mother of harlots and of the abominations of the earth”. The Greek word translated as ‘desolation’ is used two other places in the Bible, Mark 13:14 and Luke 21:20, where Jesus is discussing the same matter as in Matthew 24.)  The Bible is clear that the great tribulation does NOT BEGIN until after the flight of the Philadelphians.

 

Now Daniel directly mentions the abomination of desolation in two places (11:31;12:11) and strongly alludes to it in 9:27. Thus, it may be remotely possible that the abomination in 11:31 is a different time than the abomination in 12:11. However, since this portion of Daniel 11 is referring to the appointed time (11:29) for the end, if Daniel 11:27-45 is essentially sequential, Daniel 11:31 would need to be the time that Jesus spoke of. 

 

We may wish to keep in mind that when Jesus was asked by His disciples for the sign of His coming, He did not mention that the King of the North would first invade the King of the South (which does not happen until Daniel 11:40).  I believe that this was because this invasion does not happen until after the Philadelphians flee, hence that is why it was not included by Jesus in Matthew 24 (as this invasion happens during the time of the end and not before the time of the Great Tribulation which does not happen until vs. 24:21).

 

Since Jesus, who was specifically asked for signs of the end (Matthew 24:3), made no reference whatsoever to the king of the South being invaded prior to the time for the Philadelphians to flee AND we flee just prior to “the time of Jacob’s trouble”, I believe that Matthew 24 does support the idea that the king of the South is not attacked by the king of the North until after the USA, etc. have been.

 

 

V. Daniel 11:27-39 Beginning with a Daniel 11:27-45 Summary

 

Perhaps it would be best to begin with a summary of the key points below:

 

I believe that Daniel 11, beginning with verse 27 has future application for final fulfillment.

 

First, a deal is made between the kings of the North and South (Daniel 11:27) that may be consistent with Psalm 83 and will aid the king of the North financially. However, something happens that makes the northern king upset with the true religion that he wants to do something to (vs. Daniel 11:28). 

 

He will go back down south on a different type of mission (vs. 29) apparently with a military contingent that a western naval power (USA) dissuades (vs. 30a).  While this grieves him, something causes him to be enraged with the true religion when he is there (vs. 30b), which apparently causes comments/persecution and/or interference with our public proclamation.  He also then apparently makes a deal with those against the true religion (30c). 

 

Apparently the king of the North feels that he can go to the Middle East again (so perhaps he made some type of a deal with the USA around vs. 30b) as he stops the sacrifices and places there the abomination (vs. 31).  Those who do wicked against the true religion he will “corrupt with flattery” while God’s people will do great exploits (vs. 32).  Those who understand the truth will instruct many, yet some will fall through persecution (vs. 33), though some outsiders may help (vs. 34). Some who have understood will fall so that they can be refined (vs. 35)—this seems to be about when we flee (Revelation 12:14-16) and when Michael stands up (vs. 12:1) and thus by then are then perhaps considered to now be irrelevant by the northern king (who will probably only be concerned about the two witnesses from then on).

 

The king of the North will do what he wants (vs. 11:36) and actually regard himself above all gods (vs. 37).  But publicly he will honor the god of fortresses (the Catholic god) and a god his fathers did not know (probably a new order, or form, of Catholicism) (vs. 38). 

 

The king of the North will act against the strongest fortresses (the United States and its British-descended allies) in the name of his new religious order (vs. 39a).  He will “rule over many” and divide the American and other lands for gain (vs. 39b). (Other scriptures in various parts of the Bible are shown in the paper to support this.)

 

This will somewhat stretch his forces thin, which encourages the king of the South (who would be wary of the new religious order) to attack the king of the North who will come down and defeat him (vs. 40).  While he is rough with some countries, he lets certain peoples alone (vss. 41-42), perhaps to work oil fields. This military success will give the northern king the gold of Egypt (vs. 43).

 

But he will be troubled by news from the North and East (vs. 44) and come to his end (vs. 45).

 

Since the scenario that John Ogwyn laid out in The Beast of Revelation Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality? appears to be most consistent with the sequence in Daniel 11:27-45, I would like to quote each of these verses in italics here with my relevant comments following:

 

27 Both these kings' hearts shall be bent on evil, and they shall speak lies at the same table; but it shall not prosper, for the end will still be at the appointed time.

 

(Technical point: The expressions not in italics above are in italics in the NKJV, which suggests that they were added as they are not literally in the text.)

 

The “they” is referring to the kings of the North and South. 

 

Verse 27 suggests that some type of deal is made between the two (this would seem to be the deal that leads to the fulfillment of Psalm 83, see section XI. below).  This is likely to be the deal that sets the stage for proposing that the pope come to Jerusalem to eliminate Israeli control of that city, as well as to fulfill Daniel 11:31 and probably Daniel 11:39.

 

Notice that this deal will be based upon deceit but will result in the end coming at the appointed time. 

 

Because of that, it appears that there must be a future fulfillment of verse 27 onwards.  And this deal, (most of whose details will not be made public), may be the first major prophetic fulfillment we have suggested in sermons that we are waiting for as it may happen about the same time as the covenant in Daniel 9:27.

 

Daniel 11:21-26 may parallel the account in Daniel 11:27-45 as it appears to give details related to the same events.  Notice what Daniel 11:21-23 states:

 

And in his place shall arise a vile person, to whom they will not give the honor of royalty; but he shall come in peaceably, and seize the kingdom by intrigue.  With the force of a flood they shall be swept away from before him and be broken, and also the prince of the covenant.  And after the league is made with him he shall act deceitfully, for he shall come up and become strong with a small number of people.

 

Notice that this leader, like the one in Daniel 11:27, makes a deceitful deal. 

 

28 While returning to his land with great riches, his heart shall be moved against the holy covenant; so he shall do damage and return to his own land.

 

The above specifically indicates that something will upset the king of the North, apparently during a visit to the Palestine/Israel area, and he will return back to his land (Europe) upset with “the holy covenant” possibly spiritual Israel (as we in LCG may be reporting/broadcasting what this deal means).

 

I believe that by this time, the “short work” (Romans 9:28) will have been began or about to be finished.

 

What causes the northern king’s heart to be against the holy covenant and what he does then is not specified (the word “damage” is not in the Hebrew).  Thus, the king of the North may simply say something publicly, like threaten affect our ability to broadcast our telecast or actually stop it in places.  I suspect that we in LCG have upset him because we are telling the world in general and the Americans in particular that this is apparently the king of the North (and Great Monarch of Catholic prophecy) and that he will soon invade and destroy the American and British-descended peoples.

 

On November 10, 2007, I noticed the following translation of the verse in the CEV which seems to support my comments that the holy covenant could be LCG:

 

28 Then the king of the north will return to his country with great treasures. But on the way, he will attack the religion of God's people and do whatever else he pleases (CEV).

 

Hence, the idea that Daniel 11:28 supports that idea that the true church is the “holy covenant” is supported by those outside the COG.  The following rendering of this verse from The Message (MSG) is intriguing:

 

28 The king of the north will go home loaded down with plunder, but his mind will be set on destroying the holy covenant as he passes through the country on his way home (MSG).

 

What is intriguing to me about the above rendering?  

 

It suggests that the King of the North is shown to have made up his mind that it is time to destroy the holy covenant—or at least our message.  He may have decided to begin persecution then, affect our broadcasting ability, or at least began to think of plans to affect us—which I believe apparently will begin no later than Daniel 11:30, if it does not begin in 11:28.

 

29 “At the appointed time he shall return and go toward the south; but it shall not be like the former or the latter.

 

The 'he' is again the king of the North. This verse suggests that the 'appointed time' is not only different than any before, but that this is the specific appointed time that leads to the final end of both the king of the North and the king of the South (c.f. vs. 27).

 

Political interference, with perhaps bringing some troops on ships, is probably what is happening (see verse 30).

 

Keep in mind that in Daniel 11, there is an ‘appointed time’ (Strong’s #4150) in vss. 27, 29, and 35 (which indicates they are all in the future) which appear to be for the same specific period of time (this term is also used, for apparently the same time, in Habakkuk 2:3 and Zephaniah 3:18).

 

The specific word translated as ‘the end’ is the same word (Strong’s 7093) in vss. 27, 40, and 45 (the same Hebrew word, for apparently the same time, is also used in Habakkuk 2:3, Amos 8:2, Ezekiel 7:2-6).  Verse 45 is where the king of the North comes to his final end (it is used in vs. 40 when the king of the North invades the king of the South, which is apparently the end of the king of the South).

 

Thus, I believe it is clear that these passages are all referring to the same general period of time at the end, have not been completely fulfilled, and hence need to be understood by us now.

 

30 a For ships from Cyprus shall come against him;

 

The term translated as Cyprus, kittim, really means 'Western lands' in Hebrew.   

 

Even though he probably did not intend it this way, Dr. Meredith indirectly supported this when he earlier wrote:

 

…then this king of the North comes west against God’s people, to strike at us (Fourteen Signs Announcing Christ’s Return).

 

Daniel 11:30 suggests that a major western naval power (almost certainly the U.S.) will put on a display of force and that will upset the south-heading king of the North who will then decide to enter at least the area where Jews are making sacrifices (see next verse), perhaps in retaliation. 

 

It is of interest to note that the U.S. and its ships, from a Judean or European Union perspective are from western lands.

 

Of course, it is also possible that the U.S. or someone else could have naval ships at the Turkish portion of Cypress or some other western land.  However, no small country with a minor naval presence would be likely to stop the king of the North at that stage of history—thus the U.S. seems to be the only possible naval force mentioned here.

 

Note: Since Cypress, and other western European countries, are part (or technically in the case of Cypress, affiliates) of the European Union, I have eliminated them as being part of the ‘Western lands’ in Daniel 11.  And because the kings of the east and north are not alluded to until Daniel 11:44, I have eliminated Russia, China, India, and Japan as possible naval forces for verse 20.   

 

Furthermore, since we in LCG have concluded that the Arabs make up much of the king of the South, there is no one in an actually “western” area that I can figure out this could possibly refer to other than the U.S., Canada, or Latin America. 

 

And Latin America does not seem to be capable of having a naval force that would stop the king of the North.  Also, since Latin America is predominantly Roman Catholic, prophecy suggests that it would be cooperating with, and not opposing the Roman Catholic approved king of the North (and that is what the old WCG also taught).

 

Thus watching/understanding current world events makes it clear that the naval power would have to be the US and/or possibly its English-speaking allies.

 

For an overview, here is the entire verse 30 from the CEV:

 

Ships from the west will come to attack him, and he will be discouraged. Then he will start back to his own country and take out his anger on the religion of God's faithful people, while showing kindness to those who are unfaithful (CEV).

 

30 b therefore he shall be grieved, and return in rage against the holy covenant, and do damage.

 

The second portion of vs. 30 has long confused me, but I now think I have an idea of what occurs-- and this is probably my most radical and possibly speculative part of this paper.  It is possible that this is when the two witnesses appear (or perhaps in our between vss. 31-39) as they will undoubtedly enrage the king of the North—of course so still will the Philadelphians.

 

I suspect that partially because the US naval forces have stopped him AND an “American” church (the Living Church of God) is causing the Catholic religion problems as we are getting our message out, then once the King of the North decides to do something to our members (“damage” is not in the Hebrew) after he returns (apparently to Europe) “in rage against the holy covenant”. 

 

This may precisely be when it is stopped in an organized matter by LCG as opposed to by scattered and fleeing individuals (who seem to be alluded to in the subsequent verses).  It may be (and this is highly speculative) that the Americans agree to stop (or suspend on some pretext) our broadcast as part of the negotiations that certainly will be needed because of the encounter between the king of the North (Europe) and the naval forces of the West (America).

 

Part b of verse 30 may parallel Matthew 24:9-10. 

 

Richard Ames (Ames R. Welcome the King, Feast of Trumpets sermon for 9/13/07) and our Personal Correspondence letter L187 specifically teach (see Appendix B) that the 45 day period (the 1335-1290= 45 days) begins intense persecution against the true Church, prior to the daily sacrifices being taken away (in vs. 31), and that this will fulfill Matthew 24:9-10/12.  They also teach that the time that our organized gospel proclamation efforts (Matthew 24:14a) will be complete prior to Daniel 11:31—hence my idea that persecution etc. may be being taught in verses prior to Daniel 11:31 (like vs. 30 here) is consistent with what we currently teach.

 

It may also be the time of persecution through verse 35 (which may be include all of the 45 day period, and part of the 30 day period, in Daniel 12:11-12), which Revelation 12:13 mentions:

 

Now when the dragon saw that he had been cast to the earth, he persecuted the woman who gave birth to the male Child.

 

And if so, this appears to mainly be a persecution against the Philadelphians as they are given protection shortly thereafter (they flee shortly after Daniel 11:31).  Notice that Revelation 12:14 states,

 

But the woman was given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness to her place, where she is nourished for a time and times and half a time. 

 

Yet it needs to be understood that the woman is apparently still persecuted until verse 16 of Revelation 12—hence persecution may be occurring into the 30 day cycle.

 

30 c“So he shall return and show regard for those who forsake the holy covenant.

 

Those who forsake the holy covenant are possibly non-COG people (like Catholics) who in that sense have actually forsaken the biblical covenant or possibly those who left the Church of God (like those once in WCG so the king can learn more about us to more persecute us?).  Notice that they are shown “regard” (understanding) by the king of the North.

 

31 And forces shall be mustered by him, and they shall defile the sanctuary fortress; then they shall take away the daily sacrifices, and place there the abomination of desolation.

 

So the forces of the king of the North stop the daily sacrifices.  Since unlike in Daniel 11:30 he meets no strong western naval resistance, I believe this is precisely because he negotiated something with the USA to allow him (possibly with the Pope) to go there to broker “peace in the Middle East”—but that the king of the North does things (like stopping the daily sacrifices) that he had not told the USA.  And this may inflame the USA so much that it may be one of the reasons that the king of the North decides on a “blitzkrieg” invasion of the USA and/or its British-descended allies 30 days after stopping the daily sacrifices.

 

Revelation 11:2 states that the court outside the temple has been given to the Gentiles for 42 months (which is also 3 ½ years), while Daniel 9:27 states:

 

Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week; But in the middle of the week He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.  And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate, Even until the consummation, which is determined, Is poured out on the desolate."

 

These all appear to be related events.  The covenant in Daniel 9:27 is probably a deal in the Middle East—a deal that will apparently be broken.  The above verse is probably NOT referring to Jesus as even though He did stop the necessity of sacrifices, He did not actually stop sacrifices and He will have some sacrifices in His kingdom—thus I disagree with the position that W. Dankenbring wrote about in the Plain Truth in December 1965, that this must be Jesus. 

 

If, as we have long suggested, that the final Pope moves to Jerusalem to aid ‘world peace’ (to partially deal with the ‘Palestinian problem’), it would seem to make the most sense that the Pope moves to Jerusalem prior to the king of the South fighting the king of the North, and this may be when that would happen (this may also later give the Arab world major cause for concern as John Ogwyn wrote in his booklet and is also consistent with Psalm 83, which will be discussed later in section XI).

 

Daniel 11:31, then is just before the Philadelphians would flee as per Jesus' comments in Matthew 24:15-16 (presuming vs. 31 is the same abomination of desolation, which Dr. Meredith suggests it is in the Fourteen Signs booklet and biblically it is within the “appointed time” of the “end”).  

 

32 Those who do wickedly against the covenant he shall corrupt with flattery; but the people who know their God shall be strong, and carry out great exploits.

 

(FWIW, at its website, United COG,ia teaches, “Daniel 11:32. This is what we describe as the short prophecy of the history of the church”.)

 

Those that do wickedly against the covenant would appear to those who persecute the true Church (and who possibly who support the stopping of the sacrifices), the other nations that support the king of the North (see also Psalm 83, discussed in section XI), possibly former COG members, or perhaps this is referring to the Laodiceans (if so, this would be a major separation between the Philadelphians and the Laodiceans---which I believe must happen further sometime). It may be all of them.

 

It is likely that the Philadelphians are the ones who are strong and will carry out these great exploits (those words do not literally appear in the Hebrew text) as they apparently know their God and their works are approved for Revelation 3:8 states,

 

I know your works. See, I have set before you an open door, and no one can shut it; for you have a little strength, have kept My word, and have not denied My name.

 

The fact of a future actual fulfillment of vs. 32 is consistent with Dr. Meredith's public comments on this verse and with what John Ogwyn wrote,

 

God states clearly, "He will finish the work and cut it short in righteousness" (Rom. 9:28). Who will He use to do it? According to Daniel 11:32 it is "the people who know their God [that] shall be strong, and carry out great exploits (Ogwyn J. God’s Church Through the Ages. GCG. 1995, pp. 71-72 and LCG’s version).  

 

Joel 2:28-31 also suggests a future fulfillment, and those prophesying then may be part of those who are strong and who carry out the “exploits” and these may occur when the Philadelphians are somewhat fleeing. 

 

33 And those of the people who understand shall instruct many; yet for many days they shall fall by sword and flame, by captivity and plundering. 34 Now when they fall, they shall be aided with a little help; but many shall join with them by intrigue. 35 And some of those of understanding shall fall, to refine them, purify them, and make them white, until the time of the end; because it is still for the appointed time.

 

RC Meredith has told me that persecution of God’s people occurs in Daniel 11:33-35, but to be consistent with our other teachings, it may begin a couple of verses earlier.

 

If the Great Tribulation itself does not begin until vs. 35 or later, then vs. 33 seems likely to be referring to the Philadelphians. 

 

Why?

 

Because those persecuted in Daniel 11:33 “instruct many” and the Philadelphians who are fulfilling the first portion of Matthew 24:14 are the ones who are actually instructing many! 

 

It should be noted that while the Philadelphians are to be protected from the great tribulation (Revelation 3:10), most saints are not (Revelation 12:17; Daniel 7:25).  However, the Philadelphians are not promised protection from martyrdom prior to “the hour of trial which shall come upon the whole world” (Revelation 3:10), but in fact will be “persecuted” (Revelation 12:13) before fleeing “into the wilderness” (Revelation 12:14). 

 

It is important to notice that vss. 34-35 suggest that some Philadelphians will suffer as it is the Philadelphians that should be those of understanding.  But Daniel 12:1 suggests that this will stop, probably in verse 35 and then (probably by the beginning of Daniel 11:39 at the latest) the tribulation will begin (see section IX below).

 

Perhaps it should be pointed out that these suffering may be the Philadelphians in areas controlled or influenced by the king of the North—specifically Europe, but possibly also including Latin America.  It may be that there will be a Roman Catholic resurgence that leads to some of our people in those lands (and even the USA, etc. by self-appointed Catholic vigilantes) being killed.  (Perhaps I should add here that although our top leadership seems to believe a time of persecution is occurring to our LCG members in verses 11:33-35, we do not teach this is our Official Statement of Fundamental Beliefs, nor do many of our members understand this, though Richard Ames’ recent Trumpets’ sermon did get that message to some of the membership.  But again, I believe that it probably must start no later than 11:30 as that is BEFORE the daily sacrifices are stopped.)

 

It may also be of interest to point out that the term translated as ‘the appointed time’ in vs. 35 is the same Hebrew word translated as ‘the set time’ in Ps 102:13,

 

You will arise and have mercy on Zion; For the time to favor her, Yes, the set time, has come. 

 

This may suggest that these verses (Daniel 11:35 and Psalm 102:13) are for the same time.  If so, this is the time where God distinguishes between the Church (Zion) and those outside the Church (perhaps as a parallel to when God no longer had the children of Israel experience the plagues in Egypt, Exodus 8:22)—but this would not necessarily seem to be a distinguishing between the Philadelphian and non-Philadelphian Christians—but it very well might be (especially if Daniel 12:10 is referring to the Laodiceans, which seems probable to me).

 

However, one thing that is critical to notice is that verse 35 specifically shows that its activities go “until the time of the end”—thus there must be a future fulfillment of vs. 35.  And this may be a key verse to tie in with Daniel 12:1 (see section IX below).

 

Additionally, the Philadelphians apparently will flee during or right after vs. 35.  This will probably result in the king of the North eventually stopping to try to persecute them as after they are in the place of safety, they will not be effectively proclaiming the gospel through any major organized media effort.

 

36 "Then the king shall do according to his own will: he shall exalt and magnify himself above every god, shall speak blasphemies against the God of gods, and shall prosper till the wrath has been accomplished; for what has been determined shall be done. 37 He shall regard neither the God of his fathers nor the desire of women, nor regard any god; for he shall exalt himself above them all. 38 But in their place he shall honor a god of fortresses; and a god which his fathers did not know he shall honor with gold and silver, with precious stones and pleasant things.

 

The king will prosper and honor his own god, but himself the most. Although there have been partial fulfillments in the past, this would have be at the time of the end as it appears to be the same person that is mentioned in 2 Thessalonians 2:3-4:

 

3 Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, 4 who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

 

Since this appears to be the same person, verse 36 does appear to have a future fulfillment.

 

This would also appear to be the same person that is prophesied in Daniel 8:23-26,

 

And in the latter time of their kingdom, When the transgressors have reached their fullness, A king shall arise, Having fierce features, Who understands sinister schemes. 24 His power shall be mighty, but not by his own power; He shall destroy fearfully, And shall prosper and thrive; He shall destroy the mighty, and also the holy people. 25 "Through his cunning He shall cause deceit to prosper under his rule; And he shall exalt himself in his heart. He shall destroy many in their prosperity.  He shall even rise against the Prince of princes; But he shall be broken without human means. 26 "And the vision of the evenings and mornings Which was told is true; Therefore seal up the vision, For it refers to many days in the future."   

 

Daniel 8:23-26 definitely parallels 11:32-45. 

 

If seems that the U.S. etc. are destroyed in 8:24 which contributes to the prospering in verse 25, and the king of the South is part of the “many in their prosperity” verse 25, thus this would also suggest that John Ogwyn’s order that the U.S. etc. are destroyed before the king of the South is correct.

 

The prospering in verse Daniel 11:36 may also be related to Ezekiel 27:17. And this would suggest that we have been teaching (correctly in my opinion) that the European Union will start prospering through trading before it begins to prosper through military conquest.  Notice that John Ogwyn also wrote:

 

This European union of church and state will promise universal prosperity and will exercise worldwide economic dominance for a short while. Ezekiel 27, using the figure of the ancient commercial city of Tyre, speaks of this global economic combine which will include nations of Europe, Africa, Latin America, and Asia along with Israel and Judah (v. 17). Portions of Ezekiel 27 are paraphrased or quoted in Revelation 18 where the end-time system, called Babylon the Great, is described.
     The English-speaking nations will not prosper for long in connection with this system, however. In fact, they will ultimately be overpowered and destroyed by it militarily. Prior to military attack and occupation, devastating weather problems, combined with internal civil strife ("tumults in the midst" cf. Amos 3:9) will bring our nations to the point of internal collapse (Ogwyn J.
The United States and Great Britain in Prophecy. p. 42).

 

It should be noted that the term translated as ‘Then’ in vs. 36 (and the ‘Thus’ in vs. 39) is the Hebrew word `asah which actually means ‘And shall do’.  Therefore, it may be that every act listed is not necessarily consecutive, some (from vs. 31 to 39) may be fairly concurrent.

 

Regarding any ‘god’ in verse 37, it will probably be that he (the king of the North and the Beast) will pretend to be some type of Catholic until it is no longer convenient (c.f. Revelation 17:16-17).

 

I would like to cite the original KJV here as I believe it is a bit more true to the Hebrew intent as the NKJV gives a different impression:

 

37 Neither shall he regard the God of his fathers, nor the desire of women, nor regard any god: for he shall magnify himself above all. 38 But in his estate shall he honour the God of forces: and a god whom his fathers knew not shall he honour with gold, and silver, and with precious stones, and pleasant things (Daniel 11:37-38, KJV).

 

Verse 38 seems to be referring to two gods.  The god that his fathers did not know (possibly called the foreign god of the next verse) and the god of fortresses.  The god of fortresses is, in my opinion (based upon various Catholic pronouncements that I can cite), the Roman (Catholic) god, this is the god that he will initially honor—the Europeans know of that god.  However, the Catholic god cannot be the one that his fathers did not know, unless perhaps this has to do with new religious order within Catholicism (see explanation of vs. 39). 

 

The word translated both times as “regard” in 11:37 is the Hebrew word biyn which essentially means have intellectual understanding/appreciation of.  Essentially, the king of the North will probably consider that the Catholic god should not be taken seriously internally, though he will at first honor many Catholic beliefs publicly.

 

39 Thus he shall act against the strongest fortresses with a foreign god, which he shall acknowledge, and advance its glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and divide the land for gain.

 

The “foreign god” in Daniel 11:39 could be some new age god that he (the king of the North and the Beast) believes in, such as one where Satan provides him certain direct assistance.  Or more likely, simply be something acceptable to Catholicism that he will publicly promote and acknowledge. 

 

It is interesting to note that at least one Roman Catholic prophet pronounced that the Great Monarch (who we call the Beast or the king of the North) was going to start a new and final Catholic religious order—this Great Monarch is also supposed to team up with a pope that performs wonders according to other Catholic prophecies (please refer to my paper on Catholic prophecies).  

 

Since the King of the North is nominally Catholic, having a new Catholic order would be the most logical “foreign god” as it would not necessarily offend the other Catholics.   At least one Catholic prophecy indicates that this new “order” will result in the world becoming Catholic (and that is consistent with prophecies that the entire world will worship the Beast, Revelation 13:8). 

 

But for purposes of this paper, it is the latter portion of vs. 39 that deserves the most attention.

 

The two Hebrew words translated as “the strongest fortresses” in verse 39 do not appear together anywhere else in the Bible (since this has differing translations, please see Appendix A). 

 

Something is, thus, unique here.

 

Who has the strongest fortresses?

 

Looking down in this chapter further, we must eliminate the king of the South, because that king is not attacked until the next verse. We must also eliminate those in the North and East as they do not get involved until verse 44.

 

Neither the rest of Africa nor Latin America has anything resembling strong fortresses, let alone the strongest fortresses. The strongest fortresses belong to the United States, and to a much lesser degree, its English-speaking allies.

 

The many “ruled over” in vs. 39 would therefore seem to be those in the U.S., United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand.

 

Furthermore, the dividing of the United States, etc. for gain will in no small way help prosper the king of the North (vs. 36) as well as with others who may assist in this attack.

 

There are a few verses in Lamentations that strongly support the idea that vs. 39 is the time the U.S. etc. is punished. 

 

Lamentations 4:16, states,

 

The face of the LORD scattered them; He no longer regards them. 

 

The term translated as “scattered them” is the same Hebrew word (Strong’s 2505) used in vs. Daniel 11:39 translated as “divide”.  It is also the same word used in Ezekiel 5:1 where the hair (representing the USA, etc. according to prior WCG and current PCG teachings—CGG says this is Laodicea) is divided.

 

Furthermore, look at Lamentations 5:4-8,

 

4 We pay for the water we drink, And our wood comes at a price. 5 They pursue at our heels; We labor and have no rest. 6 We have given our hand to the Egyptians And the Assyrians, to be satisfied with bread. 7 Our fathers sinned and are no more, But we bear their iniquities.  8 Servants rule over us; There is none to deliver us from their hand”. 

 

Notice that the above passage mentions Assyria, which is who God will use to punish the USA, etc. (Isaiah 10:5-11).    Also notice that those in Lamentations are trying to receive bread from the Assyrians and the Egyptians—if the king of the South has been destroyed by this time (as Daniel 11:42 suggests), it is not likely that Egypt would be considered a viable option.

 

It may be of some interest to note that the Hebrew word translated as gain (Strong’s 4242) in Daniel 11:39 is the term translated as price in Lamentations 5:4.  The word translated as “rule over them” in v. 8, is the same Hebrew word that is translated as “rule over many” (Strong’s 4910) in Daniel 11:39.  Although this is not totally conclusive, it is further scriptural evidence that the U.S. etc. may be attacked in Daniel 11:39.

 

And that is probably when the Great Tribulation must begin.  This is the time of “Jacob’s trouble”.  However, we now officially teach that the Great Tribulation begins at a slightly different time:

 

The Bible speaks of a time of great catastrophe, called the "Great Tribulation" (Matthew 24:21-22; Daniel 11:40-45; 12:1; Luke 21:19-36)—also called "Jacob’s trouble" (Jeremiah 30:3-7) (Statement of Fundamental Beliefs).

 

The above actually is teaching that the tribulation begins in Daniel 11:40.  But since we teach that the great tribulation is actually the time of Jacob’s trouble, there is a problem here.  I really do not believe that we intend to teach that the king of the South being invaded begins the great tribulation.  Therefore, it is more likely that the USA, etc. are knocked off in Daniel 11:39 and that verse 39 begins the tribulation as far as Daniel 11 is concerned.

 

Daniel 11:24 seems to parallel verses 38-39:

 

He shall enter peaceably, even into the richest places of the province; and he shall do what his fathers have not done, nor his forefathers: he shall disperse among them the plunder, spoil, and riches; and he shall devise his plans against the strongholds, but only for a time.

 

Notice that he (the king of the North) goes against the strongholds, and gets in there peaceably—I suspect the EU will deceive the USA in order to launch a surprise attack.  This is consistent with German practices in other wars (Julius Caesar also did the same thing).  It may be interesting to note that in the next verse, Daniel 11:25, the king of the North attacks the king of the South.

 

Perhaps I should mention that the Hebrew word translated as strongholds in Daniel 11:24 is used twice in Lamentations (2:2,5), which says the strongholds of Judah and Israel will destroyed.  Since Lamentations appears to be the describing the destruction of the USA and Judah, this is consistent with Daniel 11:24 paralleling vss. 38-39. 

 

And all of this is consistent with the king of the North invading the US and its English-speaking allies prior to invading the king of the South.

 

VI.  Portions of Habakkuk May Be Prior to Vs. 39

 

God told the prophet Habakkuk that the final fulfillment of certain prophecies would take a long time to occur, and that they would be fulfilled at the time appointed.  This would seem to begin slightly prior to vs. 39 of Daniel 11, but continue until at least the end of vs. 39.

 

Habakkuk may be the only prophetic place that the Hebrew terms for “appointed time” and “end” are used together outside of Daniel.  Notice:

 

For the vision is yet for an appointed time; But at the end it will speak, and it will not lie.

Though it tarries, wait for it; Because it will surely come, It will not tarry (Habakkuk 2:3). 

 

So what did Habakkuk see in this vision?  He saw a proud and covetous people:

 

Behold the proud, His soul is not upright in him; But the just shall live by his faith. Indeed, because he transgresses by wine, He is a proud man, And he does not stay at home. Because he enlarges his desire…and cannot be satisfied, He gathers to himself all nations And heaps up for himself all peoples. "Will not all these take up a proverb against him, And a taunting riddle against him, and say, 'Woe to him who increases What is not his--how long? And to him who loads himself with many pledges'?  (Habakkuk 2:4-6).

 

Thus the Bible reveals that these are people who are greatly in debt as they load themselves up with many pledges (promissory notes to pay).  The USA is now the greatest debtor nation of all time and hence seems to be the ideal candidate to fulfill the role of the covetous in Habakkuk 2.

 

After asking how long this will go on, what Habakkuk was inspired to write:

 

Will not your creditors rise up suddenly? Will they not awaken who oppress you? And you will become their booty (Habakkuk 2:7). 

 

Notice that the creditors will finally rise up suddenly.  They will apparently realize that whoever owes them so much will not be able to pay it back.

 

And that the creditors will the make the debtors their own—thus some will apparently become slaves!  This is also consistent with Jeremiah 30:7-8 which warns that there will be a time of “Jacob’s trouble” (Jacob prayed that his name would be on Ephraim and Manasseh, Genesis 48:3-16) and that after this troubled ended their slavery would end.

 

VII. Portions of Hosea Might Be Between vs. 39 and 40

 

While I have emphasized the USA in this article, it seems likely that shortly after it is knocked off, its Ephraimite brothers (who have also been invaded around the same time) are going to try to make a deal with the king of the North to try to diminish further punishment. 

 

It is remotely possible as LCG has suggested, however, that this is around the time of Daniel 11:41-42—but I believe this happens before vs. 40 occurs.  The Book of Hosea seems to be supportive of my belief.

 

Notice what Hosea 5:5 teaches will be fulfilled,

 

The pride of Israel testifies to his face;

Therefore Israel and Ephraim stumble in their iniquity;

Judah also stumbles with them.

 

So first we see all of them (USA, Ephraim, and Judah) having problems.

 

Then notice Hosea 5:13-14,

 

When Ephraim saw his sickness, And Judah saw his wound, Then Ephraim went to Assyria And sent to King Jareb; Yet he cannot cure you, Nor heal you of your wound. 14 For I will be like a lion to Ephraim, And like a young lion to the house of Judah. I, even I, will tear them and go away; I will take them away, and no one shall rescue

 

So then Ephraim tries to make a deal.

 

Also notice Hosea 8:8-9 where Ephraim apparently tries to pay for help while Israel (perhaps the USA) is essentially gone,

 

Israel is swallowed up; Now they are among the Gentiles, Like a vessel in which is no pleasure. 9 For they have gone up to Assyria, Like a wild donkey alone by itself; Ephraim has hired lovers

 

And in Hosea 12:1 Ephraim tries to make a deal with the Assyrians,

 

Ephraim feeds on the wind, And pursues the east wind; He daily increases lies and desolation.  Also they make a covenant with the Assyrians. And oil is carried to Egypt.

 

And in Hosea 7:11-12 Ephraim tries Egypt and Assyria,

 

Ephraim also is like a silly dove, without sense--They call to Egypt, They go to Assyria. 12 Wherever they go, I will spread My net on them;  I will bring them down like birds of the air; I will chastise them, According to what their congregation has heard.

 

I will again state that there seems to be no point in going to Egypt if the king of the South has already been overwhelmed by the king of the North.  

 

There is nothing that I am aware of in world history that shows that Ephraim calls to Egypt—thus since this is a prophecy that must come to pass, this is one more reason why I believe the Bible supports the concept that the king of the North invades the US and its English-speaking allies before it invades the king of the South.

 

These verses in Hosea suggest that the Ephraimites (UK, Canada, Australia, New Zealand) and the Jews (modern Israel) think they should get some protection from Assyria (Germany), probably because the U.S. (Manasseh, Israel?) was the primary reason the king of the North attacked the strongest fortresses and/or because they have made various treaties. 

 

Furthermore it shows that one of the reasons that Israel, including Ephraim, are swallowed up is because they trusted Assyria.

 

Interestingly, Ephraim, Manasseh, and Judah are also prophesied to turn on each other to some degree (Isaiah 9:21). 

 

Hosea 10:9-11 suggests that Ephraim and Judah will be forced into hard labor, perhaps around this time as well; while 11:1-8 says that Assyria will be the king of Ephraim and Israel, because they refused to repent, and that the sword will devour their cities. 

 

The last verse in Hosea (14:9) begins with:

 

Who is wise? Let him understand these things.  Who is prudent? Let him know them.

 

And since I believe that the Philadelphians are to be the wise and prudent (note that the word translated as “prudent” above is the same Hebrew biyn that is in Daniel 11:33/35 as understand/ing), I believe that Hosea is giving us more insight as to why Daniel 11 supports the teaching that the king of the North invades the USA prior to the attack against it by the king of the South.

 

 

VIII. Daniel 11:40-45

 

Now back to Daniel 11.

 

40 "At the time of the end the king of the South shall attack him; and the king of the North shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter the countries, overwhelm them, and pass through."

 

Before looking at my comments, I would like you all to notice what a Catholic prophecy states as I believe that the Catholics have been misled by the following prophecy enough so that they will not recognize that it seems to fulfill Daniel 11:40:

 

Rudolph Gekner (died 1675). "A great prince of the North with a most powerful army will traverse all Europe, uproot all republics, and exterminate all rebels. His sword moved by Divine power will most valiantly defend the Church of Jesus Christ. He will combat on behalf of the true orthodox faith, and shall subdue to his dominion the Mahometan Empire. A new pastor of the univeral church will come from the shore (of Dalmatia) through a celestrial prodogy, and in simplicity of heart adorned with the docrtrines of Jesus Christ. Peace will come to the world." (Connor, Edward. Prophecy for Today. Imprimatur + A.J. Willinger, Bishop of Monterey-Fresno; Reprint: Tan Books and Publishers, Rockford (IL), 1984, p.36).

 

If there is much accuracy in the above, it would also show that “all republics” are to be uprooted before the Moslem king of the South is invaded.

 

Presuming that the U.S. and its allies are taken over in verse 39, there are several reasons why the king of the South may decide to launch his major attack shortly thereafter.  

 

1) The fact that “the Great Satan” (a term that certain Moslems call the USA) has been eliminated, the king of the South will realize that the deals made (Daniel 11:27; Psalm 83) with the Assyrian king of the North are of little or no value anymore. 

 

2) Next, without the nominally Protestant USA in its way, the king of the North will try to impose its non-Moslem religion on more and more of the world.  Since the Arabs tend to be more religious than the Chinese and Russians, they are more likely to get upset with this before the kings of the East and North-East do (which occurs in verse 44).

 

3) Since the Arab confederation wanted to eliminate Israel (Psalm 83) {USA, etc}, it probably will think that it greatly helped the Europeans accomplish this.  Enough so that the king of the South may become emboldened.

 

4) It is also likely that the king of the South will feel that the conquest of the USA and its allies will strain the military of the king of the North enough, that this is an ideal time to strike.  (And this is likely as it will perhaps be one of the reasons that the USA will be so easy to take over is because its own military has been strained by how thin it is spread out.)

 

5) And finally, since many of the Arab economies are dependent upon oil revenues, and most oil fields will have passed their halfway point of production by that stage, the king of the South may decide that there is no better time to attack—especially if big customers like the USA cannot be counted on to pay the higher prices that the Arabs will undoubtedly try to insist upon.

 

Also note that this attack against the king of the South occurs 'at the time of the end'. Thus, even if this had some fulfillment with Mussolini (as HWA often suggested), it most likely has a future fulfillment (as HWA also suggested) as the end still has not yet come.

 

Verses 40 and 41 may be paralleled by Daniel 11:25-26.  Notice:

 

He shall stir up his power and his courage against the king of the South with a great army. And the king of the South shall be stirred up to battle with a very great and mighty army; but he shall not stand, for they shall devise plans against him. 26 Yes, those who eat of the portion of his delicacies shall destroy him; his army shall be swept away, and many shall fall down slain.

 

Now my Hebrew is not good enough to be certain whether verse 26 is referring to the king of the South or the king of the North.  If it is the king of the North, then this is somewhat paralleled by Daniel 11:45, but again, Daniel 11:26 may simply be referring to the end of the king of the South.

 

41 He shall also enter the Glorious Land, and many countries shall be overthrown; but these shall escape from his hand: Edom, Moab, and the prominent people of Ammon. 42 He shall stretch out his hand against the countries, and the land of Egypt shall not escape. 43 He shall have power over the treasures of gold and silver, and over all the precious things of Egypt; also the Libyans and Ethiopians shall follow at his heels.

 

The “he” is the king of the North.  I presume that the Glorious Land is physical Israel—it would not appear to be the USA as the nations referred to are Middle Eastern/north African (LCG’s written position, by R. Ames, agrees that it is modern Israel).

 

It may or may not be important to note that the specific expression 'king of the South' is not used anywhere in the Bible after verse 40.

 

All the nations specifically mentioned in these verses are in Africa or the Middle East (note: the term translated as “Ethiopians” is the plural of the word Hebrew Kuwshiy, which according to Biblesoft's New Exhaustive Strong's Numbers and Concordance with Expanded Greek-Hebrew Dictionary means descendants of Cush.  The Nubian Cushites are normally Moslems, and have dwelled with the Arabs so long, that they consider themselves to have been “Arabized”).

 

It is remotely possible that the U.S. etc. are part of the many countries in vs. 41 or the countries in vs. 42, but I suspect this is referring to countries allied with the king of the South as it is a few Arabic peoples that escape, while others (like Egypt) do not.  If one of those is the U.S. etc. then we should teach that the great tribulation begins in vs. 41 or 42 and not verse 40 as we now do.

 

It would not seem that the king of the North would attack the USA, etc. while it is in the middle of overrunning the Middle East (and area that has been historically difficult for outsiders to govern).

 

One side note, and that is that in Egypt major gold deposits have been found.  This is relevant for a couple of reasons, including that it does prove that Egypt now does have enough gold that some foreign power would be interested in taking/using it.  It also suggests that gold will still be a valuable item into the tribulation (though near/during the day of the Lord it will become less than worthless, see Ezekiel 7:19).  I would speculate, based upon my visits to various countries around the world, that once the US dollar totally collapses that people all around the world will consider that even if the Euro is strong, that having a truly gold-backed would be safer.  So having the EU power acquiring a lot more gold to back the EU currency may greatly increase its credibility/prosperity/influence around the globe.

 

44 But news from the east and the north shall trouble him; therefore he shall go out with great fury to destroy and annihilate many. 45 And he shall plant the tents of his palace between the seas and the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and no one will help him."

 

In Daniel 11:44, it shows that those from the east and north end up battling the king of the North.  Historically, we have felt that this is the Russians, Chinese, and other Asians. 

 

This is also consistent with Revelation 16:12 where “the kings of the east” are associated with the sixth angel pouring out his bowl (it is also consistent with the military force that can field a 200 million man army, as shown in Revelation 9:16—only the Asians appear capable of this).

 

Note that vs. 45 shows that king of the North comes to ‘his end’ ‘at the appointed time’, which is what is prophesied in verse 27.  This is also consistent with Revelation 16:19 where Babylon is divided and the great cities fall (seventh angel’s bowl). 

 

As a side note, perhaps I should quote what one COG critic has written about Daniel 11,

 

Now, no one has ever come up with a convincing, coherent interpretation of all of Daniel 11 that successfully served as a map to predict future events. " (The Watcher.  HWA's 209 False Prophecies.  Painful Truth website). 

 

I, however, believe that we in LCG are close to uniformly doing so.  And hopefully the expounding of those verses in this paper will help get us there sooner.

 

IX. Time of Jacob's Trouble and Daniel 12

 

Jeremiah 30:7 states,

 

Alas! For that day is great, So that none is like it; And it is the time of Jacob's trouble, But he shall be saved out of it.

 

This verse suggests that the time of the U.S. etc. being knocked off is around the tribulation as Jesus taught,

 

For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be (Matthew 24:21).

 

And that is what we in LCG teach.  Yet we indicate that the tribulation begins at the time of the king of the South’s downfall (Daniel 11:40) in our statement of beliefs.

 

As soon as the time of Jabob’s trouble begins also appears to be when the “holy people” are delivered to the Beast power (Daniel 8:24; 7:25; Revelation 12:17).

 

Jeremiah 30:7 is similar to Daniel 12:1 being a time of trouble for "your people" as well.

 

Daniel 12:1 states:

 

"At that time Michael shall stand up, The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation, Even to that time. And at that time your people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book.

 

It appears that “your people” would be considered those of Israel, though since Daniel was from Judea (1:6) it is possible, though not likely, that it may only be the Jews.  The your people are probably the true Christians.

 

It does not appear the events of Daniel 12:1 all sequentially follow Daniel 11:45, nor did the old WCG teach that.  Also, neither LCG nor the old WCG have ever taught that the battle between the king of the North and those in the east and north were BEFORE the tribulation (I also learned that neither do certain Protestant commentators).

 

There may be a translation problem in Daniel 12:1 that has led to some of the confusion. 

 

The expression "At that time" (used twice in Daniel 12:1) is made up of two Hebrew words, eth and huw' which mean 'now' (or when) and 'he' (or this/that), which suggest that verse 1 should instead begin with "Now he" and use "now his" later in the same verse. Thus Daniel 12:1 could possibly be better translated as:

 

"Now he, Michael, shall stand up, The great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people; And there shall be a time of trouble, Such as never was since there was a nation, Even to that time. And now his people shall be delivered, Every one who is found written in the book.  

 

An important question is when does Michael stand up?

 

The answer, just before the tribulation begins. 

 

When does that fit into the Daniel 11 sequence?  Well since the same Hebrew word translated “At that time” (or “now” by me) is used in Daniel 11:35.  Apparently Michael stands up and we are protected (this would seem to be when it is time to flee, or during when the Philadelphians are fleeing—see Revelation 12:16, where the “earth” helps the woman).

 

Let’s look what we as far as when the tribulation begins from point twelve in the Fourteen Signs booklet,

 

12. The Collapse of the English-speaking Nations—The Great Tribulation.

 

Thus it seems that we teach that the collapse of the U.S. etc. begins when the tribulation begins. I believe this happens in or by Daniel 11:39 (the US could collapse internally before being destroyed militarily in Daniel 11:39, which is consistent with Habakkuk 2 and our other writings, but the tribulation probably begins with an overwhelming military attack against the US, etc.).   

 

But the following LCG literature might, in contrast, suggest it occurs after Daniel 11:41:

 

The capture of Jerusalem by the "beast" superpower signals the time of the great "tribulation" and "the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled" (Luke 21:22).

     Although the word "Jerusalem" means "city of peace," Jerusalem has experienced bloody fighting and wars over the millennia. But soon, this great city will truly be the city of peace for all peoples. That is good news you can look forward to!

     We need to be aware of these major events foretold in Scripture. The prophesied "great tribulation" is primarily the time of trouble for the U.S. and the British-descended peoples, who are descended from the ancient patriarch Joseph. When he was near death, Jacob blessed two of his grandsons—Joseph’s sons Ephraim and Manasseh—and said: "The Angel who has redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; let my name [Jacob, i.e. Israel] be named upon them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth" (Genesis 48:16).

     The end-time prophecies relating to Jacob, or Israel, generally refer to the descendants of Ephraim and Manasseh who were given Jacob’s name. Scripture gives an end-time warning about a great "tribulation." Upon whom does this tribulation fall? "Alas! For that day is great, so that none is like it; and it is the time of Jacob’s trouble, but he shall be saved out of it" (Jeremiah 30:7)…

Jesus gave us a key sign to watch for, which will signify the beginning of the great tribulation and trouble in the Holy Land. He warned: "‘Therefore when you see the "abomination of desolation," spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place’ (whoever reads, let him understand) ‘then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains’"…

Notice that Jesus Himself gives the sequence of events. He warns us about the abomination of desolation in Matthew 24:15, then explains the first prophetic milestone in verses 21 and 22: "For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened." This is a time unique in all history. It is the time of Jacob’s trouble (Jeremiah 30:7), the time of God’s punishment on the Western nations—including the United States, Britain, Canada, Australia and New Zealand…

That "beast," as we have seen earlier, is the political and military power that will invade the Middle East.

     John continues, describing this great harlot: "And on her forehead a name was written: MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND OF THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH" (Revelation 17:5). It will be that system dominating the great tribulation period…

Jesus’ warning sign concerning the end-time fate of Jerusalem: "But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near" (Luke 21:20). Whose armies are these? Who will eventually invade the Middle East and control Jerusalem—its most significant city?

     As we saw earlier, the king of the North—the "beast power" or revived end-time Roman Empire—will enter the Glorious Land (Daniel 11:41).

  (Matthew 24:15–16). (Ames, R.  Middle East in Prophecy booklet, online 4/25/07).

 

We have interpreted Jesus’ comment in other places to refer to Daniel 11:31, yet by tying

Daniel 11:41 and Matthew 24:15–16 together are we teaching that the actual time Jesus is warning about does not occur until Daniel 11:41? 

 

I’m sorry that I may be misunderstanding this, but this seems to be a possible error.

 

X. Daniel 8

 

There are other relevant sections of the Bible (like Revelation) and even in Daniel that are consistent, but not necessarily explicit, with the prophetic order advocated in this article.

 

For example, Daniel 8:17 states that the vision earlier is for the 'time of the end'.

 

What vision? 

 

Probably what is shown in Daniel 8:9-14,

 

9 And out of one of them came a little horn which grew exceedingly great toward the south, toward the east, and toward the Glorious Land. 10 And it grew up to the host of heaven; and it cast down some of the host and some of the stars to the ground, and trampled them. 11 He even exalted himself as high as the Prince of the host; and by him the daily sacrifices were taken away, and the place of His sanctuary was cast down. 12 Because of transgression, an army was given over to the horn to oppose the daily sacrifices; and he cast truth down to the ground. He did all this and prospered. 13 Then I heard a holy one speaking; and another holy one said to that certain one who was speaking, "How long will the vision be, concerning the daily sacrifices and the transgression of desolation, the giving of both the sanctuary and the host to be trampled under foot?" 14 And he said to me, "For two thousand three hundred days; then the sanctuary shall be cleansed."

 

Vs. 9 seems to be documenting the growth of the European Union.  It began in north-western Europe and then added mainly (except Ireland) countries south and east of it.  With its technical arrangements (though not membership) with Israel and Turkey, and “peace-keeping” troops in Lebanon (and perhaps soon elsewhere), it is making strides ‘towards the Glorious Land’—which we teach is modern Israel, not the USA, etc. 

 

Vss.11-12 seems to be consistent with Daniel 11:30-39.  Notice that prospering is mentioned in 8:12.  While this certainly includes prospering by trade, it also seems to include prospering because of military conquest—and vs. 12 mentions an army.

 

XI. Assyria: Psalm 83 and Isaiah 10

 

The 83rd Psalm appears to be important to understand regarding when the king of the North attacks the USA etc. as well as the king of the South.

 

Psalm 83:3-8 states,

 

They have taken crafty counsel against Your people, And consulted together against Your sheltered ones. 4 They have said, "Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation, That the name of Israel may be remembered no more." 5 For they have consulted together with one consent; They form a confederacy against You: 6 The tents of Edom and the Ishmaelites; Moab and the Hagrites; 7 Gebal, Ammon, and Amalek; Philistia with the inhabitants of Tyre; 8 Assyria also has joined with them; They have helped the children of Lot. 

 

Here are some quotes from Richard Ames that mention Psalm 83:

 

Notice that the king of the North enters into the "Glorious Land." That is modern Israel. Edom, Moab and Ammon (generally identified as modern-day Jordan) escape out of his hand, which indicates that Jordan will be allied with the European power. Psalm 83 identifies those peoples who will confederate with Assyria against Israel, an alliance including Moab, Ammon and Edom. (Ames, Richard. Who Will Invade the Middle East?  Tomorrow’s World.  July-August 2004).

 

One of the Psalms also confirms both historically and prophetically that Edom, Ishmael and Amalek are joined in a confederacy against Israel. "They have said, ‘Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation, that the name of Israel may be remembered no more.’ For they have consulted together with one consent; they form a confederacy against You: the tents of Edom and the Ishmaelites; Moab and the Hagrites; Gebal, Ammon, and Amalek; Philistia with the inhabitants of Tyre; Assyria also has joined with them; they have helped the children of Lot. Selah" (Psalm 83:4–8) (Ames, Richard.  Middle East in Prophecy.  Version online 12/20/06).

 

When can the above occur? 

 

I would not think that this can occur after the king of the North invades the king of the South as the groups would probably no longer be in cooperation.  Hence it may have to occur before.

 

In my experience in the Church, this 83rd Psalm has been explained three different ways. 

 

1. One was that perhaps the “Your people” and “Your sheltered ones” are those Philadelphians in a place of safety.  I should add that, however, this is not consistent with how this section of scripture has, in writing, been referred to by the old WCG or recent LCG writings.

 

2. A second way is possibly suggested in some of LCG’s literature. 

 

Richard Ames also wrote:

 

In Daniel 11, we find two antagonists: the king of the North and the king of the South. In ancient times, Syria was considered to be the king of the North. But the Roman Empire conquered Syria, which became a province of Rome in 64bc. Bible prophecy shows that by the time of the end, the king of the North will be identified with the revived Roman Empire. Then: "At the time of the end the king of the South shall attack him; and the king of the North shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter the countries, overwhelm them, and pass through. He shall also enter the Glorious Land, [or the Holy Land] and many countries shall be overthrown; but these shall escape from his hand: Edom, Moab, and the prominent people of Ammon. He shall stretch out his hand against the countries, and the land of Egypt shall not escape" (Daniel 11:40–42).
     Notice that the king of the North enters into the "Glorious Land"—the location of the modern state of Israel. The fact that Ammon (which Bible scholars identify as modern-day Jordan) escapes out of his hand, along with Edom and Moab, leads many to believe that Jordan will be allied with the European power. Psalm 83 identifies those peoples who will be confederate with Assyria against Israel. That alliance includes Moab, Ammon and Edom.
     Daniel 11:43 gives us an indication of those nations allied with the king of the South. These are the peoples of north Africa. Verse 40 states that the king of the South attacks the king of the North…
     The king of the North’s armies will occupy northern Africa and the holy land. But developments in the northeast so disturb this king that he takes military action. Daniel 11:44, "But news from the east and the north shall trouble him; therefore he shall go out with great fury to destroy and annihilate many. And he shall plant the tents of his palace between the seas and the glorious holy mountain; yet he shall come to his end, and no one will help him." (Ames, Richard.  Middle East in Prophecy.  Version online 03/09/07.)

 

The above writing does not seem to allow a time between verse 40 through verse 44 for the USA (especially since we have literature hinting this happens in vs. 41), etc. to be invaded (though it does not absolutely preclude that).

 

The above writing also seems to be suggesting that the nations in Psalm 83 are only aligned with the king of the North in Daniel 11:41 (which is the portion I bolded above).  However, this does not seem to be consistent with who comprise the king of the South.  Maybe I do not understand what we are saying here.

 

Why?

 

Because we also seem to claim that the king of the South includes the many of the nations listed in Psalm 83.  Now I am not claiming that we have an absolute contradiction, but there does seem to be some problems, because a defeated Arab block would probably not be plotting against USA/Israel.

 

Notice a comment about who we teach is involved in Psalm 83:

 

Despite such intrareligious conflict, Scripture tells of a coming Arab-Muslim confederacy. In Psalm 83, King David of ancient Israel reveals that Israel's adversaries will achieve at least a degree of unity in the not-too-distant future. In verses 6-7, David lists by their ancient names the peoples who will join together in an anti-Israel confederacy-Arab and Muslim nations of the Middle East, supported by sympathetic elements in Europe-seeking to wipe Israel from the face of the earth! (Bowmer W.  Islam in History and Prophecy.  Tomorrow’s World.  July-August 2001).

 

Notice who we say is involved with the king of the South:

 

Daniel 11:43 gives us an indication of those nations allied with the king of the South. These are the peoples of north Africa… the end-time king of the North will be provoked by the king of the South. We have already seen war in the Middle East over the issue of oil. Will there be another Arab oil embargo like that of 1974? (Ames, Richard.  Middle East in Prophecy.  Version online 03/09/07).

 

Presently, the whole Islamic world in the Middle East and North Africa is being enveloped by a wave of resurgent Islamic fundamentalism. Islamic fundamentalist insurgencies, funded by rogue states and terrorist organizations, are trying to destabilize the moderate, Western-leaning, secular regimes currently in power, and are seeking to replace them with a unified, resuscitated Islamic caliphate (empire)—the prophesied "king of the South." The final leader over these reinvigorated Muslim nations will be a tremendously powerful religio-political false Messiah or "Mahdi" who will draw his power from a confederation of those nations. He will provoke the key events written in Daniel 11, which must occur before the return of Jesus Christ to this earth… He will feel emboldened to provoke or attack the European Union (Daniel 11:40). This will anger the fierce "king of the North" and the forces of the king of the South will be completely crushed by this European power. The king of the North will then come down "like a whirlwind" (v. 40) and take over the Middle East, including the Holy Land (vv. 41–42). The king of the North’s armies will seize control of the region’s vast oil reserves (v. 43). (Meredith RC. Fourteen Signs Announcing Christ's Return.  Online version 03/09/07).

 

This will certainly carry over into their backing for a truly powerful pan-Arab leader when God’s time comes (Meredith RC.  Living Church News. July-August 2004).

 

A powerful leader—called in Daniel 11 the “king of the South”—will then arise, able to bring about temporary unity of much of the Islamic world. Provoked by this leader, Europe will launch a “blitzkrieg” resulting in European occupation of much of the Arab world (Daniel 11:40–43). (Ogwyn J. The Beast of Revelation: Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality?  Online version 03/09/07).

 

We seem to teach that the king of the South and those involved in Psalm 83 are the same peoples (it is possible that we teach that the people of North Africa are not the same as the Arabs, and although in some instances that is true, I do not believe we are intending to teach that they are different here).

 

Since it is not likely that a militarily strong USA would allow the Arabs and Germans to cut off the nation of Israel in the beginning of Daniel 11:41, if Psalm 83 is not referring to the Arabs and Germans conspiring to get rid of all the descendents of Joseph and Judah (perhaps Daniel 11:27), I am confused as to what we have written about what is happening here.

 

3. The third way to explain Psalm 83 is that it is possible that it is telling us that the Muslims are conspiring against the U.S., Israel, etc. as the US, etc. could be the “Your people” and that the Assyrians will later decide to join in and make it happen.  Since we repeatedly teach that the time of Jacob’s trouble is the time of trouble for the US, its English-speaking allies, and Israel, it makes sense that Psalm 83 is referring to all of them.

 

If that is what this is saying, then it is consistent with the king of the North attacking the U.S. etc. prior to attacking the king of the South. 

 

Notice that the position of the old WCG in 1979 was that Psalm 83 is apparently discussing an alliance to destroy the USA/Israel that occurs BEFORE the king of the North invades the King of the South (perhaps in partial fulfillment of Daniel 11:27):

 

King David of ancient Israel in a prophetic psalm (Psalm 83) provides additional insight into the Mideast picture. Germany (Assyria in Bible prophecy) and perhaps the rest of Europe will be in league in the future with a union of Arab nations--a vast confederacy bound together in an effort to crush out the name "Israel" from the face of the earth! This Arab-Moslem confederacy may very well be the previously mentioned "king of the south"--a sphere of power encompassing vast portions of the Islamic world.

 

"They have said, Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation; that the name of Israel may be no more in remembrance. For they have consulted together with one consent: they are confederate against thee: The tabernacles of Edom [Esau or modern-day Turkey, a non-Arab but Islamic nation], and the Ishmaelites [Saudi Arabia]; of Moab [part of Jordan[, and the Hagarenes [anciently these peoples dwelt in the area known as Syria today]; Gebal [Lebanon], and Ammon [modern Jordan], and Amalek [part of the Turks]; the Philistines [the modern Palestinians] with the inhabitants of Tyre [Lebanon]; Assur [whose descendants, the Assyrians, migrated to Germany] also is joined with them: they have holpen the children of Lot [Jordan and Western Iraq]"

 

Amazingly, such an alliance is already in the making!...

 

But in the end, this European-Arab alliance will prove short-lived...And the king of the north shall come against him [the king of the south]...The Arab-Moslem Confederation will, of course, be thrown into chaotic disarray in the fact of invasion (Psalm 83:4-8) (Stump K. The Arab World in Prophecy.  Plain Truth. December 1979).

.

Thus, IF the peoples in Psalm 83 are the peoples who primarily compose the future king of the South, THEN Psalm 83 would seem to occur BEFORE the king of the North invades the king of the South.  However, it might be POSSIBLE that this alliance in Psalm 83 only involves some of the nations that border Israel (like Jordan), but I really do not think so.

 

We have, of course, long taught that Assyria would punish the Israelite nations like the USA.  For example, Douglas Winnail wrote this (bolding mine):

 

The Bible indicates that at the end of this age, the Israelite nations’ chief antagonist will be Assyria (Isaiah 10). God will use Assyria and its allies to punish Israelite nations that have forgotten their God (Isaiah 10:5–7; 24–25)… Though few modern scholars look to the Bible for clues to understand geopolitics, the Bible’s prophetic references to Assyria in the "last days" do indeed point to modern Germany  (Winnail D. Modern Nations and God’s Ancient Plan.  Tomorrow’s World.  July-August 2006).

 

R.C. Meredith wrote:

 

Prophecy is dual. God used ancient Assyria to punish the Ten Tribes of northern Israel more than 100 years before the house of Judah was taken captive by Babylon (2 Kings 17:6; 25:21). In this time of the end, however, God will use the modern descendants of ancient Assyria, together with the prophesied modern revival of the Babylonian/Holy Roman Empire system, to punish His wayward, sinning people—primarily Canada, Britain and America. These modern descendants of the patriarch Israel will be punished for their sins, just as surely as our ancestors were. And the Jews, plus the other remaining tribes of Israel and the Gentiles who live among them, will also receive their share of punishment at the same time (Meredith R.C.  How God Intervenes in World Affairs.  Version Online 12/20/06).

 

Recall, that Isaiah says this about Assyria,

 

5 Woe to Assyria, the rod of My anger, And the staff in whose hand is My indignation. 6 I will send him against an ungodly nation, And against the people of My wrath I will give him charge, To seize the spoil, to take the prey, And to tread them down like the mire of the streets. 7 Yet he does not mean so, Nor does his heart think so; But it is in his heart to destroy, And cut off not a few nations (Isaiah 10:5-7). 

 

It may be that the Assyrians decide to attack after they have made some type of deal with the Muslims (Daniel 11:27) who intend to destroy the U.S. as well (perhaps Psalm 83).  Perhaps the Muslims will later feel that the king of the North has been sufficiently been weakened through attacking the U.S., etc. (such as by expending many of its missiles and spreading its troops too thin, vs. 39) to make an attack against the North feasible (vs. 40).

 

Anyway, since we believe that Psalm 83 is not about the Philadelphians in a place of safety, then it seems to me at least to strongly support the idea that the king of the North attacks the US, etc. before attacking the king of the South. 

 

Currently, we have scattered Muslims interested in attacking the US and Israel.  It is not only possible, it is likely that more and more of the Arabic peoples will decide to be against the U.S. and Israel (and perhaps by default the UK, Canada, Australia, and New Zealand). 

 

A strengthened Assyria (through a militaristic EU) would be the ally that could pull it off for the Arabs.  All of this is clearly consistent with Psalm 83. 

 

I also do not believe that Psalm 83 can be fulfilled after Daniel 11:40 and prior to Daniel 11:42 because while a weaken king of the South still could be interested in eliminating Israel, its focus after being invaded would be most likely to deal against the King of the North, NOT COMING UP WITH PLANS TO KNOCK OFF ISRAEL that the King of the North would then decide to support.

 

It is illogical to me that within those verses (Daniel 11:40-42) that a defeated King of the South will be allowed by the King of the North to obtain enough weapons to allow the former King of the South nations to feel it can conspire against the USA, etc.  The king of the North would not need Arab support to destroy the nation of modern Israel then.

 

XII. The Other Order

 

It appears that HWA originally developed his scenario by 1935 when he saw Mussolini partially fulfilling Daniel 11:40, and thought since this was occurring, that the U.S. etc. must be attacked later. 

 

That is also what he probably would have originally taught Dr. Meredith and some of our other leaders.  I believe that later HWA somewhat changed his teaching, which is why Dr. Meredith expressed an uncertainty on this subject when I discussed it with him a few years ago.

 

It probably should be pointed out that there is a passage in Jeremiah 13:18-21 that conceivably supports the position that the U.S. is eliminated after the king of the South,

 

18 Say to the king and to the queen mother, "Humble yourselves; Sit down, For your rule shall collapse, the crown of your glory." 19 The cities of the South shall be shut up, And no one shall open them; Judah shall be carried away captive, all of it; It shall be wholly carried away captive. 20 Lift up your eyes and see Those who come from the north. Where is the flock that was given to you, Your beautiful sheep? 21 What will you say when He punishes you?

 

However, when I look into the context of Jeremiah 13, I see nothing about this being for the latter days, end-time, or other similar period. I would also add that the only other times the expression 'queen mother' is used in the Bible it is referring to someone physically alive in Judah/Israel. And since this passage is specifically referring to Judah, it would not appear to be referring to the U.S., etc. 

 

And the cities of the South mentioned are probably cities of southern Judea.

 

Thus, while I believe I understand why HWA, RCM, and others may have been confused on this matter, I believe that scripture simply does not support the position that the king of the North takes over the king of the South prior to the invasion of the USA, etc.

 

Perhaps I should add that Luke 21 has been suggested to me as proof by a lay member that the King of the North attacks the King of the South prior to attacking the United States, etc.  So, let’s quote what Jesus said there:

 

But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its desolation is near. 21 Then let those in Judea flee to the mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not those who are in the country enter her. 22 For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled. 23 But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people. 24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled (Luke 21:20-24).

 

There may be three issues to be dealt with that citation. 

 

The first is that the Luke account discusses only Gentiles in Jerusalem and not the nations we believe will be part of the king of the South.

 

The second is that while Daniel 11:31-32 seems to be referring to Jerusalem as it is where historically sacrifices took place (especially if it is where Daniel 9:25-27 is fulfilled), no later verse in Daniel is clearly referring to Jerusalem.  While Daniel 11:41 does discuss “the Glorious Land” this is not necessarily restricted to Jerusalem anymore than Daniel 11:31 might be.

 

The third issue is that this is the same time in Luke 21 that is discussed in Matthew 24 and Mark 13 shown below:

 

Therefore when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing in the holy place" (whoever reads, let him understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains (Matthew 24:15-16).

 

So when you see the 'abomination of desolation,' spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not" (let the reader understand), "then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains (Mark 13:14).

 

The above “abomination” becomes present in Daniel 11:31.  This is when we in LCG suggest that a 30 or 45 day period begins.  A time when our people are persecuted.  I do not believe that we are to wait to flee until AFTER the King of the North invades the King of the South and prior to some time in verse 41 when possibly the USA, etc. are attacked.

 

I do not believe that in 30 to 75 days that the first six/seven will all occur:

 

1.     The Abomination is set up (Daniel 11:31)

2.     We are do exploits and are persecuted (Daniel 11:32-36)

3.     The king of the North goes against the strongest fortresses (Daniel 11:39).

4.     The King of the South attacks the King of the North (Daniel 11:40).

5.     The King of the North responds (Daniel 11:40).

6.     We flee this late (between verses 40 and 41) and will be in the place of protection in the wilderness.

7.     The king of the North enters the Glorious land (vs. 41).

8.     The USA, etc. are somehow knocked out when Egypt is (vs. 42).

 

I believe we flee by verse 39 (probably vs. 35), because the fulfillment of verse 39 apparently begins the time of Jacob’s trouble.  Immediately after we flee (Matthew 24:20), the tribulation (Matthew 24:21)—the time of Jacob’s trouble begins.  While it could also be the time of Egypt’s trouble, I do not believe that Egypt’s trouble begins at the same time or just before (especially since we believe that Egypt is part of the King of the South who is overwhelmed in Daniel 11:40)—I believe that Daniel 11:41 and 42 just provide more details of the elimination of the King of the South and modern Israel, not an indication that the USA, etc. are getting attacked then.   

 

XIII. Minor Rewrite 1. R.C. Meredith’s Fourteen Signs Announcing Christ's Return Booklet

 

While I realize that I do not work for LCG, I have been repeatedly asked to advise LCG concerning any errors or issues I might find in our teachings.  And I do have some suggestions to resolve the apparent contradictions, for your consideration.

 

To make this easier to follow, my suggested additions or rewrites will be bolded.

 

I would suggest adding this as the fourth paragraph of chapter 5:

 

Before this happens, it appears that the kings of the North and South will enter into some type of alliance that neither one of them intends to keep.  “Both these kings' hearts shall be bent on evil, and they shall speak lies at the same table; but it shall not prosper, for the end will still be at the appointed time” (Daniel 11:27).

 

I would suggest rewriting the end of chapter 5 to state:

 

(Remove the statement, This dramatic military response against the king of the South will set off a chain of other events”.)

 

The story continues in Daniel chapter 12. "At that time Michael shall stand up, the great prince who stands watch over the sons of your people; and there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation, even to that time." This is talking about the American, the British Commonwealth and the Jewish people. So, right before this great Muslim "king of the South" causes a war, and the European "king of the North" conquers much of the Middle East, then this king of the North comes west against God’s people, to strike at the United States and many of its English-speaking allies (this is described in more detail in chapter 6). This is the beginning of the Great Tribulation. This is the same time Jesus described in Matthew 24:21: "For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be."

 

Even if there is a decision against the position that the king of the North strikes the USA, etc. before the attack by the king of the South, I believe that we should eliminate the word “us” currently in the booklet that is in the expression strike at us, because the booklet is intended for people other than Americans, Brits, Canadians, etc. and “us” is somewhat inappropriate.

 

I would suggest rewriting the end of chapter 6 to state:

 

     "But in their place," this coming Hitler type will "honor a god of fortresses," or a god of munitions, as some translations have it (which is a “god” many will be familiar with); "and a god which his fathers did not know” (which may be a new religious order) “he shall honor with gold and silver, with precious stones and pleasant things" (v. 38). This powerful individual will dedicate tremendous amounts of international resources to building up his military machine. And he will worship his power and that military machine.

      "He shall deal with the strongest fortresses by the help of a foreign god. Those who acknowledge him he shall make more wealthy, and shall appoint them as rulers over many, and shall distribute the land for a price" (Daniel 11:39, NRSV).
     Here is this awesome power of a coming "Hitler," and, as we explained, there will be exactly ten nations or groups eventually in Europe having ten kings or rulers over them. They will give their power and strength to this coming dictator, this "Hitler," for a short time just before Christ’s return.  This Hitler will deal with the strongest fortresses and distribute the land for a price that will help his regime prosper.

     Now who has the strongest fortresses in verse 39?  Well, it cannot be the king of the South as this clash does not happen until verse 40.  It cannot be the major nations of the East or the North-East as they do not become involved until verse 44.  The only other powers on the earth today that could be considered to have the strongest fortresses would be the US and British descended peoples, which are basically (though not all entirely) west of the Middle East.  They also have a lot of land and assets that could prosper a major power like a union of European nations.

With the US and British descended peoples taken out of the way, this will embolden the king of the South.  And as verse 40 shows, this European power block will then fight against the Islamic power block to the south.

 

We may also wish to switch the order of chapters 5 and 6 to put them in more of a chronological sequence.

 

XIV. Minor Rewrite 2.  John Ogwyn’s The Beast of Revelation Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality?

 

The late John Ogwyn left out most of the scriptural support for the position that he wrote.  In this “rewrite” I am just adding scriptural citations.

 

It may be of interest to note that I did discuss the necessity of this with John Ogwyn while he was living, and suggested that the next edition of this booklet include the citations.

 

A great charismatic leader in Europe will arise (Daniel 11:27,29)...He will enter into an alliance of church and state (Daniel 11:36-39) that will offer peace, security and prosperity (Daniel 11:36) to a desperate world. Using duplicity and intrigue (Daniel 11:32/11:21-23), he will induce ten European leaders (Daniel 2:42/Revelation 17:12), representing the end-time successors to both the eastern and western parts of the Roman Empire, to unite temporarily and give their power to him as leader (Revelation 17:12-13)...A period of growing peace and prosperity will ensue. A great worldwide trading combine will seem to offer incredible profits to international cartels (Revelation 18:3; Daniel 11:36). Later, after responding to crises involving both the Middle East and the English-speaking nations (Daniel 11:29-30), this leader will move with lightning speed and iron determination. Annulling a treaty previously made with the Jewish state (Daniel 9:27), his armies will overwhelm Jerusalem and will take half of the city into captivity (Zechariah 14:2, Daniel 11:31). Quickly thereafter, an attack of overwhelming force will be launched on America, Britain, Canada and related nations (Daniel 11:39)...The coming European superpower may actually co-opt existing global institutions to use as a political structure for its own ends. Though important developments will occur in the political sphere, it is in the area of religion that we will see events unprecedented in modern times (Daniel 11:37-39; Revelation 13:4-18). Religion will be considered the key to bringing about the common identity required for political unity. By this time, millions all over the globe will have been caught up in a religious frenzy fed by a charismatic leader working what are apparently great signs and wonders (II Thessalonians 2:9; Revelation 13:13-14; Matthew 24:14). More concerned with "feeling good" than with true doctrines, they will respond to this leader’s false promise that he is ushering in a golden age. A powerful war-making apparatus marshaled by the coming European superpower will be billed as the cornerstone of world peace and security (Daniel 11:38; Revelation 13:4). Modern technology will be used to create a police-state that Hitler and Stalin could only have dreamed about (Revelation 13:16-17). People will be induced to accept such draconian measures as the price of getting rid of terrorism and violent crime. At first, this system will bring an upsurge in the world economy (Daniel 11:36,39; Revelation 18:15-19). A worldwide trading combine, prophesied in Ezekiel 27 and Revelation 18, will be hailed as the key to universal prosperity. Those at the helm of this system will, for a short time, enjoy unparalleled wealth. Yet fatal flaws in this system, inherent from its beginning (Daniel 2:41-43), will in time produce widening disparities. The Arab world will be displeased by attempts to coerce it into religious unity with Europe (Daniel 11:31,36-40). A powerful leader—called in Daniel 11 the "king of the South"—will {omit then arise} arise to bring about temporary unity of much of the Islamic world (Daniel 11:27,40). Provoked by this leader, Europe will launch a "blitzkrieg" resulting in European occupation of much of the Arab world (Daniel 11:40–43). This European occupation will deepen suspicion among the eastern nations—already wary of the German-led Europeans. Rumors from the eastern capitals will ultimately cause the Europeans to launch what is intended as a pre-emptive attack to intimidate the East into submission (Daniel 11:44). Things will not go as well as planned, and the resulting warfare will ultimately cause the nuclear destruction of much of Europe (Daniel 11:44-45) including Rome itself (Revelation 18:10, 17), by the alliance of eastern powers (Revelation 9:13–18). As eastern armies cross the Euphrates River (Revelation 16:12) to launch an invasion of the European-controlled Middle East, events will spin totally out of control. The ten European rulers who gave power to launch this system will bitterly turn on the church and religious system which failed them (Revelation 17:16–17). Horrifying weapons of mass destruction, including nuclear weapons as well as biological and chemical weapons (Revelation 9:5–6, 18; Zechariah 14:12), will be unleashed. Just when it appears that humanity will destroy itself as a result of the confrontation in the Middle East, the living, glorified Christ will return from heaven (Matthew 24:22) (Ogwyn J. The Beast of Revelation Myth, Metaphor or Soon-Coming Reality? LCG Booklet, October 2000).

 

For consistencies sake, it is possible that the order of some of those statements might make a bit more sense if this is changed, but I left the above order as written.

 

XV. Minor Rewrite 3. Richard Ames’ Middle East In Prophecy booklet   

 

In addition, I would for now suggest the Middle East In Prophecy booklet, version 2.1 the following rewrite to Richard Ames booklet (pages 14-15):

 

In Daniel 11, we find two antagonists: the king of the North and the king of the South. In ancient times, Syria was considered to be the king of the North. But the Roman Empire conquered Syria, which became a province of Rome in 64bc. Bible prophecy shows that by the time of the end, the king of the North will be identified with the revived Roman Empire. The Bible shows that these kings will make some type of dishonest deal (Daniel 11:27) consistent with the 83rd Psalm and: "At the time of the end the king of the South shall attack him; and the king of the North shall come against him like a whirlwind, with chariots, horsemen, and with many ships; and he shall enter the countries, overwhelm them, and pass through. He shall also enter the Glorious Land, [or the Holy Land] and many countries shall be overthrown; but these shall escape from his hand: Edom, Moab, and the prominent people of Ammon. He shall stretch out his hand against the countries, and the land of Egypt shall not escape" (Daniel 11:40–42).
     Notice that the king of the North enters into the "Glorious Land"—the location of the modern state of Israel. The fact that Ammon (which Bible scholars identify as modern-day Jordan) escapes out of his hand, along with Edom and Moab, leads many to believe that Jordan will be allied with the European power. Psalm 83 identifies those peoples who will be confederate with Assyria against Israel. That alliance includes Moab, Ammon and Edom…

 

Watch for increasing unity among Arab nations in their stand against Israel. Psalm 83, which we read earlier, lists those peoples who comprise Arabic and Muslim nations in the Middle East. They are supported by European groups in their strong opposition to the descendants of Israel. "They have said, ‘Come, and let us cut them off from being a nation, that the name of Israel may be remembered no more.’ For they have consulted together with one consent; they form a confederacy against You" (Psalm 83:4–5). Watch for an end-time Arab/Muslim union or confederacy forming against the descendants of Israel.

 

XVI. Concluding Summary

 

There are aspects of our literature that contradict themselves or at least suggest that we are unsure of certain prophetic events that I believe we should now know.  While I have made specific suggestions for some of them, there are ramifications for other ones that this paper implies.

Whether you believe that all the positions I have suggested are correct or not, this problem needs to be resolved.

 

Psalm 83 seems to be referring to the deal between the kings of the North and South in Daniel 11:27.

 

The fulfillment of Michael standing in Daniel 12:1 seems to be tied to events beginning in the end of Daniel 11:35.  The great tribulation begins by Daniel 11:39 and or after Daniel 11:40, but not beginning with Daniel 11:40 as out official statement states.

 

Daniel 8:23-26 provides parallel support that the U.S. etc. are knocked off prior to the king of the South.

 

Habakkuk 2 and Lamentations supports the position that the verses in Daniel 11:39 refer to the U.S., etc.

 

Unless we believe that something other than the United States and its English-speaking allies are the strongest fortresses, it is clear that the U.S. etc. are knocked off during Daniel 11:39.  The Bible makes it clear that these particular strongest fortresses do not belong to the European Union, the king of the South, Russia, or any of the kings of the East.

 

It does not seem to be consistent enough with the sequence in Daniel 11 for the U.S. etc. to be knocked off after the king of the North overwhelms the king of the South and that the confederation of Psalm 83 would then form.  The king of the North would not need that to destroy the nation of modern Israel and also would not be likely to support substantial Arab rearmament then.

 

The totality of scriptures I have reviewed strongly support the position that the king of the North attacks the US, etc. prior to attacking the king of the South.  I believe not only is it logical to read Daniel 11:29-45 in order, that a future fulfillment of vss. 29-39/40 is consistent with the Bible and with our historical teachings.

 

Although this paper was not intended to cover every aspect of the Book of Daniel, hopefully it has shown how many of aspects of it may fit better that perhaps we have realized.  I believe that we must modify our literature in several places as it all needs to be correct in as many aspects as possible.

 

And while I believe that the order that John Ogwyn laid out is correct, we in LCG need to prove (or disprove) it so that we all understand the same thing.  And of course, since the Bible shows that those that read (Matthew 24:15) and those who are wise will understand (Daniel 12:10), I believe we really do need to understand this sequence.

 

Also notice Amos 3:7-8:

 

7 Surely the Lord GOD does nothing,

Unless He reveals His secret to His servants the prophets.

8 A lion has roared!

Who will not fear?

The Lord GOD has spoken!

Who can but prophesy?

 

I know that all of you are aware of that particular portion of Amos.  I would like you to consider that if we are who you and I believe we are, and God does nothing until His servants know, then the end will not come until we truly understand the prophecies, particularly the prophetic sequence of Daniel 11 (as Daniel 12:10 confirms).

 

I believe that this paper, if basically correct, will help us better explain many upcoming prophetic events and thus help LCG do a better job of getting the warning message out to the world.

 

 

 

 

 

Appendix A.  John Wheeler and Translations of Daniel 11:39

 

After my meeting in Charlotte in January 2007, I sent John Wheeler the following in an email:

 

Again, all I really would like is your opinion on Daniel 11:39.  The NKJV and the KJV differ.  And this difference makes a huge difference. 

 

His unedited response is below:

 

Just for the record, here are the various translations of Daniel 11:39 as given on the e-Sword program:

 

Dan 11:39

 

(ASV)  And he shall deal with the strongest fortresses by the help of a foreign god: whosoever acknowledgeth him he will increase with glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for a price.

 

(CEV)  With the help of this foreign god, he will capture the strongest fortresses. Everyone who worships this god will be put in a position of power and rewarded with wealth and land.

 

(DRB)  And he shall do this to fortify Maozim with a strange god, whom he hath acknowledged, and he shall increase glory, and shall give them power over many, and shall divide the land gratis.

 

(ESV)  He shall deal with the strongest fortresses with the help of a foreign god. Those who acknowledge him he shall load with honor. He shall make them rulers over many and shall divide the land for a price.

 

(GNB)  To defend his fortresses, he will use people who worship a foreign god. He will give great honor to those who accept him as ruler, put them into high offices, and give them land as a reward.

 

(GW)  With the help of a foreign god, he will deal with strong fortresses. He will give high honors to those who acknowledge him, make them rulers over many people, and distribute land for a price.

 

(HCSB)  He will deal with the strongest fortresses with the help of a foreign god. He will greatly honor those who acknowledge him, making them rulers over many and distributing land as a reward.

 

(KJV)  Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

 

(KJV+)  Thus shall he do6213 in the most strong holds4013, 4581 with5973 a strange5236 god,433 whom834 he shall acknowledge5234 and increase7235 with glory:3519 and he shall cause them to rule4910 over many,7227 and shall divide2505 the land127 for gain.4242

 

(KJVR)  Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

 

(LITV)  And he shall act in the strongholds of the fortresses with a foreign god, whom he shall acknowledge. He shall multiply in glory, and he shall cause them to rule over many and shall divide the land for a price.

 

(MKJV)  So he shall act in the fortresses of the strongholds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge. He shall multiply in glory, and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for a price.

 

(MSG)  Marching under the banner of a strange god, he will attack the key fortresses. He will promote everyone who falls into line behind this god, putting them in positions of power and paying them off with grants of land.

 

The problem with this parallel citation is that it suppresses the italics designed (in some versions) to show where some words have been added or are thought to be implied.

 

Here is the New King James Version, which I'll type in by hand, followed by the KJV (likewise revised by hand):

 

(NKJV) Thus shall he act against the strongest fortresses with a foreign god, which he shall acknowledge, and advance its glory; and he shall cause them to rule over many, and divide the land for gain.

 

(KJV)  Thus shall he do in the most strong holds with a strange god, whom he shall acknowledge and increase with glory: and he shall cause them to rule over many, and shall divide the land for gain.

 

Actually the KJV and the NKJV are not substantially different at all, except for "thus shall he act against the strongest fortresses" versus "thus shall he do in the most strong holds". The NKJV conveys the sense of the Hebrew more directly (the particle is le-, "to", not be-, "in"). On the other hand, neither handle the clause that follows "god" very well. Many interpreters prefer something like "those who acknowledge him [the 'foreign god'] he shall increase with glory". This is consistent with the grammar and accentuation, taken in their simplest senses. Some versions take the implied "him" to refer to the king himself, as the above excerpts show.

 

One complication is that the written text itself says hakir ("shall acknowledge him)", but the Masoretic marginal note there says to read yakir ("he [the king] shall acknowledge") instead. Keil & Delitzsch say that this marginal reading (the "qeri") is an unnecessary emendation of the main written text (the "ketiv"), and I'm inclined to agree with them, but some versions follow the marginal reading.

 

Keil & Delitzsch state rather adamantly that the word translated "for gain" should be taken as "for a reward"; and that seems to fit the particle be-, in this case apparently the so-called bet essentiae (a be- that defines the nature of a thing). "Price" (as in my RSV) is one possible meaning of mechir, but so is "hire, reward, gain" (BDB Lexicon). I think that this is what the KJV and NKJV intend, but they could've stated it more clearly. The idea apparently is that the land is being given to the supporters of this foreign god -- and/or the king -- as a reward for their support. That would be consistent with some kind of feudal system, such as prevailed in Catholic Europe for so long.

 

Thus, John Wheeler, who is not one who I believe has much of a position on this matter either way (and he so indicated in another email), is “neutral” on the translation.  And on his neutral translation he concurs with my basic position that the NKJV translation does properly capture the intent of the Hebrew.  And that is that the king of the North is prophesied to go against the strongest fortresses—which looking at the world today—would have to be the USA and its closest allies—especially in the context of the other nations alluded to in Daniel 11:40-45.

 

Appendix B. LCG and the 1335, 1290, and 1260 Days

 

John Wheeler wrote (not in response to my previously mentioned email) what he indicates is Richard Ames’ position on the 1335, 1290. and 1260 days:

 

Mr. Ames (from Daniel 12:11-12) points out that there will be a 45-day period followed by a 30-day period, both preceding the 1,260 days of the Tribulation and the Day of the LORD. If memory serves, we've taken the 45 days as the time of severe persecution for the Church and the 30 days as the time of flight of part of the Church (Matthew 24:9-14, 15-20; Mark 13:9-13, 14-18; Luke 21:12-19, 20-23; Revelation 12:13, 14-17).

 

Since in Ezekiel's prophecy "Jerusalem" represents both national Houses of Israel, and since "Jerusalem" is punished therein without distinction between its component Houses of Israel and Judah, here seems to be the simplest explanation:

 

1) During the 45 days, the Church is severely persecuted (Revelation 12:13).

 

2) During the 30 days, the "abomination" is set up, and those saints who are in the ancient land of Judea (and presumably elsewhere: Revelation 12:14) flee to the mountains east of the Jordan. Since in Ezekiel 5, the several verses in Hosea where "Ephraim" and "Judah" are mentioned together (e.g., "Ephraim...Judah also"), and so on, the indications are that the punishment on both would come together, I would think that the final attack on both Houses shall begin then and not sooner. We do not yet know just how formidable the Beast's war-making power shall be -- only that it shall be unparalleled up to that time. It could be, however, that just as the ancient House of Israel fell before the ancient House of Judah, so shall it be in modern times. Will that extend to any degree to the order in which the ancient King of Assyria conquered the northern tribes?

 

3) After the Church is split into those protected and those left behind, the Tribulation as such begins (that is, the fire going into "all the house of Israel", refining the third, and even the tenth, of it that is left -- cf. Zechariah 13:8-9 and Isaiah 6:9-13).

 

If that is the case, then perhaps there are forty-five days that encompass Daniel 11:28 or 30 through verses 35.  And right now, I suspect that that is so.

 

It seems to be consistent with what we currently and publicly teach on the 1,290 and 1,335 days of Daniel 12 (this the L187 letter based on John Ogwyn's and Richard Ames' input):

 

 
 


Dear Friend,

            Thank you for your question concerning the mysterious 1,290 and 1,335 days prophecies in Daniel 12:11-12.

            These prophecies refer to events leading up to Jesus Christ’s return and the resurrection of faithful Christians and saints.  Daniel 12 emphasizes a great “time of trouble” (v. 1), the same “Great Tribulation” of which Jesus spoke in Matthew 24:21.  Daniel’s theme is “the time of the end” (v. 4), the time at which, when “the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished” (v. 7).  Notice that Daniel will “arise” in the resurrection at the “end of the days” (v. 13). 

            Daniel makes a brief statement about the 1,335 days that lead up to “the end”: “Blessed is he who waits, and comes to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days” (v. 12).  God gives this blessing to His people who endure for the 1,335 days until Christ’s coming.  Jesus stated in Matthew 24:13, “But he who endures to the end shall be saved.” “Waiting” usually implies patiently enduring trials and persecution.  Notice what Jesus says in the preceding four verses (Matthew 24:9-12).

            We may not know the exact time when the 1,335 days begin, since no one knows the day of Christ’s coming (Matthew 24:36; Acts 1:7).  Apparently, however, at the beginning of the 1,335 days, the organized efforts of God’s Work to proclaim the Gospel to the world will end.

            Daniel 12:11 describes the next milestone 45 days later: “And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days.” Daniel points out that two events take place 1,290 days before “the end of days”: the daily sacrifice is taken away and the abomination of desolation is set up.  This prophecy indicates that the Jews in the modern nation of Israel will restore the twice-daily animal sacrifices (see Exodus 29:38-39).  The end-time “abomination of desolation” (Matthew 24:15) and the “man of sin” (2 Thessalonians 2:3) will cause the sacrifices to cease.  Historically, Antiochus Epiphanes desecrated the Temple during his assault on Jerusalem in 167-164bc, fulfilling this prophecy in type.  When the end-time sacrifices cease (see also Daniel 9:26-27), there will be 1,290 days, a little more than three and one-half years, until the appearance of the Messiah, Jesus Christ.

            Jesus gave another sign, or key event, to watch for.  When the armies of the “beast” (see Revelation 17) surround Jerusalem, we should then “know that its desolation is near” (Luke 21:20).  To learn more about this end-time power, request our free booklet, The Beast of Revelation.  We learn from Revelation 11:2-3 that the Gentiles will “tread the holy city under foot for forty-two months” and that the “two witnesses” will prophesy during that same 1,260-day period!

In chapter 12, verse one, Daniel announces the beginning of the Great Tribulation, which Jesus also proclaimed in Matthew 24:21-22.  This “time of trouble” will last three and one-half years, “a time, times, and half a time” (Daniel 12:7; Revelation 12:14).  Jesus said that the abomination of desolation would be a sign for God’s people to flee before the Great Tribulation begins (Matthew 24:15-20).  Those counted worthy (see Revelation 3:10) will then be taken to a place of safety God has provided for them (Revelation 12:14-16).  Once God’s Church is in a place of protection, the 1,260 days (“a time, times, and half a time,” or 42 months) of tribulation and judgment will begin.  At the end of the 1,260 days, Jesus Christ will return to this earth.

If you have further need of information, please let us know.

PERSONAL CORRESPONDENCE DEPARTMENT

 

Richard Ames, in his DVD sermon for the 2007 Feast of Trumpets titled Welcome the King, essentially seems to agree as he specifically stated that the abomination is set up at the 1290 days, and that the Great Tribulation begins 30 days later and that persecution (Matthew 24:9-10) begins 45 days earlier at the start of the 1335 days.  And I agree with that.

 

I simply contend that the time of Jacob’s trouble begins with the USA, etc. being invaded and that there does not seem to be enough time in the sequence to allow the King of the North to invade the King of the South prior to invading the USA.   Unless we believe that this invasion needs to be prior to the beginning of the 1335 days.  But scripturally, it seems that the sequence for the King of the North to invade the USA, etc. before the King of the South is on firmer foundation.